Friendly Fire: Massie's Mess, Trump Victorious & Dr. Oz's War on Fraud

True self-reliance begins with taking control of your health. Our sponsor, Armour Calostrum, harnesses nature's original blueprint for resilience. Our bodies face constant pressure from toxins, processed food, processed, bovine colostrum that's sustainably sourced with a commitment to calf-first sourcing. With over 400 bioactive nutrients, it fortifies your entire gut wall system, and strengthens your immune system from the cellular level up. This means balanced immune health, better digestion, less bloating, and support for healthy metabolism and fat burning from the inside out. Elite athletes have been using colostrum for years because it enhances nutrient absorption, builds lean muscle, and speeds recovery. But the benefits go way deeper. Cellular level support for hair, skin, energy, everything. This isn't processed or manipulated. It's pure, potent, and natural. Your body's blueprint for rebuilding itself the way it was designed to function. When you invest in your health, you invest in your ability to show up fully. Think clearly and stay in control no matter what comes your way. We've worked out a special offer from my audience. Received 30% off your first subscription order. Head on over to armor.com slash Josh Shapiro or enter Josh Shapiro to get 30% off your first subscription order. That's A-R-M-R-A.com slash Josh Shapiro. The FIFA World Cup is here and you can now feel the thrill of the pitch in FIFA World Cup launch edition on Netflix, a fast and fluid football game where your phone is the controller and the TV is the stadium. Play for your country in 16 different stadiums with up to four friends, all included in your membership. Scroll to the games tab on your TV and play FIFA World Cup launch edition now only on Netflix. New England summers don't exactly ease you in. One minute the windows are open. The next, your apartment feels unbearable. Well, meet Windmill Air. Windmill window ACs are sleek. They're quiet and cool your space fast. Without the bulky eyesore, rated the number one easiest AC to install. Windmill lets you adjust temperatures right from your phone. And unlike traditional units, cools your room more evenly like Central Air. Shop windmill online at windmillair.com or pick up an AC at your nearest. Target or Home Depot. Windmill, modern air care, your room deserves. Why aren't we on the air, by the way? Why are we on the air? Why aren't we? We're waiting for Knowles. I mean, Knowles is like. I don't know. You smoking a cigar? I don't know. Why are you asking, Claven, if you had not brought Noel to a dinner party 15 years ago, none of this would have been a problem. It is my fault. It's just such a good invitation to be online. I'd say everything. Everything winds up being my fault. It's funny, you know, whatever happens. It all comes back to me. Yeah, that's true.

Fine, let's just do that. No, I don't care. It's an improvement. I think, yeah, no, I think it raises the level of the conversation. Okay, fine. Okay, so what are we going to talk about? Are we going to just start talking about pine cones or what? I'm sorry. I hate to admit this. I don't know what the pine cone thing is about. Oh, okay. I'm going to have Bayeah explain this to you so that I don't get in HR trouble. Baia, explain the pine cone thing to Clayvane because I prefer not to be sued. Well, I don't know. Like, I don't want to get sued. But, all right. And also, the reason I bring this up is, are we actually recording already? And we're all recording all this, but we'll cut out anything that is unpleasant. Which is to say three quarters of the show will be cut out. No, no. So I want to give Laura Lumer credit because I feel like she often has great reporting and she never gets credited for it. But she will go into the gutter and get the people and find the people. And like last night was really Laura Lumer's night. And what she did was she found a woman who claims to have had an affair with Thomas Massie. two months after his wife died. And the things that she claimed he asked her to do, they're perverse. I will not repeat them. But in part of her, what she sort of what Laura got out of her was that Thomas Massie allegedly also had an affair with Lauren Boebert and in text messages would refer to his genitals, specifically his male member. as his pine cone. And I truly want to know. I know, I know, it's horrific. But I truly want to know, like, I'm sure a lot of us feel that like the downfall of Thomas Massie was sort of of a piece with the downfall of the podcast stereo and the influencers with no influence. And these people who have turned rabidly anti-Semitic on the right who pretend to have influence, there's that, there's the fact that, you know, he really pissed off Trump. And Trump is the kingmaker. But to me, I really do want to know, like, did Pine Cone Gate make a difference to the people of Kentucky? I'm going to go know that the Pine Cone Gate really didn't make a difference. If it had been Cactus Gate, that would have been a completely different thing. I mean, I'm just, honestly, like, what other parts of the natural world would be worse to label your member than a Pine? Yeah. You're running into, like, see an enemy gate? Like, I don't know. Coral Gate. Like, what are we talking here? And apparently he was texting with women using this name, right? I mean, like, I think that's where the text came from. Is in a text with a woman, he was referring allegedly to his member as a pine cone. And it's like, I'm just wondering. I know I entered a little bit late here, but I do want to tell the audience, we have the pine cone coming on actually later in the show. So be sure to stay tuned because this is Friendly Fire. That's coolies enemies. The friends are these goodies enemies. That's pornographic. Is that, yeah, well, that's for behind the paywall. Obviously, you know, you've got to subscribe for that. You don't get to put the pie button onto YouTube. Only pine guns. Can I ask a question about this, though, because the only part of this I actually heard, and maybe this is selective deafness on my part. But the only part of this I heard was the part that he had an affair with a woman two months after his wife died, which I didn't think was so bad.

What was she going to do? Come back? I mean, she died. He moved down. It is interesting. You know, like on all of the dirt that they were digging up on Thomas Massie right before the election. Yeah. It is interesting that, look, I mean, a lot of it was like raised a lot of eyebrows and probably didn't represent good judgment if it was true. But yeah, right. You're right, Drew. It wasn't, they didn't allege that he cheated on his wife. They didn't allege that kind of impropriety. So, you know, it was kind of typical political stuff. Some of it was kind of weird, like the pine cones or whatever. But it, all of it together, I was confident. I'd be curious to know what you all were thinking yesterday. I predicted Thomas Massie was going to go down. I didn't know it was going to be a nine point swing, but I predicted he was going to go down. And the reason why, it wasn't just because of the big, beautiful bill, it wasn't just because of the pro-Israel donors, it wasn't just because of this, that, or the other thing. It was because he was acting like a guy who was about to lose. This is correct. Right, yeah, all right. Thanks. Yeah, no, this is totally like, okay, so first of all, like, you don't run a campaign in northern Kentucky. in which your chief issue is Israel and the Jews. That's the dumbest thing you can do. Because if you think that the voters in Northern Kentucky are thinking about that, you're out of your mind. His district has 780,000 people and it's less than 500 Jews. And so if you actually want to know what happened in that election cycle, it's very easy. Watch the local TV ads. The local TV ads were Thomas Massie trying to hump Trump's leg. And then the rest of the campaign was Trump saying, get off my leg. That was the entire campaign. The entire campaign was saying it was Ed Gal Ryan being like, dude, Trump doesn't like you and you're not going to make it happen. You're trying too hard. And Thomas Massie being like, no, no, no, we're best friends. We're super best friends. And Trump tweeting, I don't even like him. I want him gone. He's the worst. And so the entire race. We can't paper over the fact. What's kind of funny with Thomas Massie is he had a super pro-Israel billionaire donor who was backing him. But there's no, there's no doubt. pro-Israel donors and, you know, sort of commentators. Yeah, for sure, but that's because he was vulnerable. Yes, it's because he was vulnerable. And the other thing is, though, because a lot of the massy supporters are basically trying to peg the whole thing on Jews for the reason he went down. But within the context of Brad Raffensperger going down, Bill Cassidy going down, the five state legislators in Indiana going down, within that context, I think you've got to say, the reason he went down, even if the Israel donors played a role in the race, the reason he went down, it's the same reason all those other guys went down, and it's because they opposed Trump and Trump owns the party. That's 100% right. Libertarians are inherently annoying, though, because they're constantly saying, I'm standing on principle. I'm not going to play politics. And I keep thinking, you're a politician. It's like Aaron Judd saying, I'm not going to play baseball, you know? It just doesn't make any sense. You know, the guy would not compromise over anything. They're all the same. I mean, Rand Paul, who I kind of like is like this, too, though. They will not play the game, part of which is getting the president's agenda, you know? And so I just think.

Trump was like, be gone, you know? Yeah, and Michael, to your point, the reason you knew he was going to lose is because he started running campaign where it was like, what if I have over podcast Nazis to my house? And I'm not joking. I mean, it was literally people wearing sweatshirts that said American Reich on them. Really? He wasn't really trying to. Yeah, no, that was real. That was real. And so, like, that is, that is not the move of a person who thinks he is long for the Congress. That is a person who is trying to steer into the dollars and cents a podcast stand and making a future for himself. And by the way, I will point out, the strange respect he is likely to receive for this campaign from MSNBC and from New York Times and from all of these clowns is demonstrative of the fact. that if you want to be accepted in left-wing world, what you really should do is steer into the anti-Israel anti-Semitism stuff. It is not about resistance to Trump. You know who is more resistant to Trump than Thomas Massie, a guy named Bill Cassidy, who voted for his actual impeachment in 2021. You think Bill Cassidy is going to be on MS now anytime soon as a resistance hero? There's no way in hell. But Thomas Massie will, and so will Marjorie Taylor Greene, and so will Joe Kent, and so will the rest of these clowns. And that is because, again, the anti-Semitism of the left. is now baked into the cake. I mean, that is a very real thing. From Graham Platner up in Maine to this insane House Democrat down in Texas, who is literally calling for me to go to an internment camp, like to be sent to an, and I have to be sent to an internment. I think, Drew, technically you may too. Drew, you may be there too, Drew. It depends on her classification of jury or not. I don't know, I don't know if your conversion was effective. So it's, so I'm, you know, it all depends. But, you know, what that says is, that Thomas Massie, at a certain point here, I think when Trump came out against him, realized that he was going down. And he was like, well, I'm going to launch a new movement that is sort of, you know, the horseshoe right and the woke left altogether, and we will be best friends. And I think that that's really what the campaign became. As far as the Jewish American money that came in, and it was not Israeli money. That's illegal. It was Jewish American money that came in to that race via A-PAC and via other super PACs. Well, yeah, the guy's wildly anti-Israel. And it turns out that a lot of donors would like to see him go because he opposed things that they like. That's what happens in every race. But you'll notice that it was not until Trump actually started the process of kicking his ass out of Congress that that happened because he won over 75% of the primary vote in 2020, 2022 and 2024. And it was only when he went up against Trump. And things started to get really squirley for him. Yeah, no, this is the key, Ben. I think, because, like, I don't mean to paper over it or gaslight. Like, obviously, there were a lot of pro-Israel donors who didn't like Thomas Massie. And, you know, Thomas Massie kind of earned their ire in many ways and a lot of his comments. But first of all, he's not the only congressman who voted against funding for Israel. And, like, the hypothetical I think of here is, had Thomas Massie voted for the big, beautiful bill, had Thomas Massie gone along with the White House and... Not liked Israel, voted against funding Israel, even made comments that were anti-Israel. If that were the case, I think he would still have his seat. In other words, it's not that the pro-Israel donors would like him or anything like that, but it's that Trump was this sort of catacom figure. And it was when Trump said, hey, buddy, you're out. That was when all of the other political machinations really started to play out. But to be fair, Thomas Massie, doesn't send anybody money. Yeah.

But didn't Trump back his opponent? Thomas Massie has won before against a Trump-backed opponent. I think I see this exactly the opposite as Michael Knowles. I think Americans, especially on people on the right, people on the right, people on the left are very comfortable criticizing Israel right now. But there is a line in the sand when it becomes obvious that it's not just Israel you have a problem with, which, you know, Rand Paul doesn't, you know, want to fund Israel. I don't. ever feel like he's being anti-Semitic. There's a line where you cross that it's not just Jews and it's not just pro-Israel people. The American people have very little tolerance for anti-Semitism. And when you start saying that the Republican Jewish coalition, just Republican Jews are somehow undermining American interests because they're, you know, trying to whip up support against you. That reads, I think, to average Americans as really anti-Semitic. And I think it's really off-putting. Like, I think the fact that he, you know, the Trump piece obviously is a really big deal. But he won before against a Trump-back candidate. I really think it was the tonal shift, the way that he talked about Israel. It stopped being the same as the way he talked about Ukraine. It stopped sounding like it was a principal opposition to funding and to war and started sounding like he was attacking American Jews. And I feel like average Americans, they're not so into Israel right now, but they are very protective of their Jewish neighbors. And I think that that just came off as so gross. Like his opening to his concession speech where he said, I had to go find my opponent's phone number, and he's in Tel Aviv somewhere. I think we have the clip. Do we have the clip? I would have come out sooner, but I had to call my opponent and concede, and it took a while to find Ed Galrine in Tel Aviv.

I did get the call. I have called and conceded the race. We've been honorable the whole time, and we're going to stay that way. Ha. He's been honorable the whole time. The whole time, except that that gives Americans the ick. I wish you were right, Baja, but I don't think that's true. I mean, I think that people in America, people tend to be tolerant. They tend to be fairly accepting as long as you leave him alone. But I don't think that that's what brought him down. I mean, Trump stomped on the guy. It was a curb stomping. And it was kind of unfair. I mean, I don't think Thomas Massie has actually been that bad. If you just consider him as a series of votes, I don't think he's been that bad. He's been quite good in a lot of ways. Yeah, no. Yeah, a lot of ways he's fine. I mean, I just think he got up Trump's nose. Well, people are really sick of a Congress that cannot accomplish anything. And I think that there's something else. Trump's way. It's going to be, yeah. I think there's something else there with Thomas Massie, too. One is, yes, he is the most obstructionist congressman on the right. I mean, there's no question. He was a consistent no vote for every major agenda item that Trump was pushing, which pissed Trump off. But there was something else that we're ignoring here, which is that Thomas Massie decided to make it his chief goal in life. to drag Trump through the mud with a bunch of bullshit about Jeffrey Epstein, right? He and Ro Khanna decided that they were going to run an op going after Trump, right? He was going to reach across the aisle and then suggest that Trump was covering for a child sex trafficking ring. And he was on video, I mean, naming people in the files who were guilty of nothing, which they then later had to admit. And he decided he was going to ramp this up. So I think that actually the anti-Semitism, as always, is the symptom, not the cause. I think that he started thinking in very conspiratorial ways about American politics, in grievance-based ways about American politics. He started attributing that to weird, clickish conspiracies like the quote-unquote Epstein class and all this stuff. And Trump read that, and he's like, listen, it's one thing for you to vote against me sometimes. It's another thing for you to vote against me always. It's another thing for you to go on MS now and talk about how I'm covering up child sex trafficking. The answer here is no. And it just turns out that the crossover between believing all of those former things and also believing that the Jews are deciding on your fate at their Friday night dinners, the crossover there tends to be almost 100%. If you are a conspiratorial thinker who does grievance-based politics and also opposes every element of Trump's agenda, the chances that you are going to, you know, be wandering around outside in the rain. ranting about the Uden is pretty high. Yeah, no, you know, there was this clip that was going around. It was one of the last real knocks on Thomas Massie, you know, 11th hour. And it was him being interviewed by hostile journalist saying, hey, why do you oppose Trump and why have you voted against the GOP on these crucial votes, whatever? And he said, hey, hey, hey, I vote with the Republicans 91% of the time, but 9% of the time I don't vote for them because they're covering up for pedophiles. And I thought, okay, hold on, wait. That doesn't even make a coherent political position. So you agree with the petos and the pedo protectors, 91% of the time. I don't want to agree with them on any percent of the time. And so, you know, what he represented to me, if you kind of zoom out from these individual issues or the individual donors or whatever, is he had two problems going for him. One, he voted 77, a little over 77% of the time with the GOP in Congress, this term, which is way below the median GOP congressman who voted 95%

percent of the time. This was also down from Thomas Massie last term, who was voting 91% of the time GOP, which itself was down from the previous term when he voted 95% of the time GOP. So you can say, look, I hate the GOP, I'm glad he bucked the party, I like that he's independent, whatever, but that's not going to win you support with the party. And then the other issue was, and this gets to your point, Ben. You know, when you're palling around with Ro Khanna, one of these unctuous left-wing figures who's just constantly taking shots at the right, when you're calling your colleagues and the people who are supposed to be on your team pedophiles, essentially. I mean, what you're expressing is not just independence from the party. You're expressing a kind of contempt for the party and a contempt for the leader of the party. And it just, at that point, the vice president put it very well. He said, look, if you did, look, I've gotten along with Thomas in the past. We've agreed on a lot of things, but. You know, if you're going to go against the party in such a brutal way, you can't expect the party to back you. So, I want to get, I'm going to get, I think that kind of backs great possible theories. Sorry, sorry, go ahead, Drew. Now, I think that kind of backs what Ben was saying that the Jewish issue is really part and parcel of this horseshoe where the right meets left. I mean, I cannot see the difference between most of the people who are spouting this stuff. I can't see the political difference. They're all seem to be on the same side. And the worst of the kind of hatred than the Jew hatred that comes out is in the New York Times, you know, which has always kind of been in that position. So I do think that there is this way that this guy just drifted out of the main. stream of the right, which actually doesn't adhere to a lot of that stuff. Well, you know what I like to do is drift out of consciousness so that I can go take a nice sleep on my helix mattress. But I think there's what I like, hold on one second about you. Hold on. Hold on. Hold on. Hold on. Hold on. Hold on. I had a great transition. I'm going to do it again. You know what I like to do is drift off to sleep on my Helix mattress. What you got to do right now is go to helixleep.com slash friendly fire, which it will feel a lot less clunky than my transition did. We love our sponsors, Helix. They let you sleep really, really well. Helix has a sleep quiz that uses your preferred sleep position, firmness, and other factors to match you with the right mattress for you, which is a far more rational system than wandering around a showroom and laying on random beds. Helix is an award-winning mattress brand reviewed by outlets like Forbes. and wired, gentlemen, and maybe Batia, you too, I'm not sure. I know you at Drew and Ben, you guys love your helix mattresses. I do. I get to stay awake on it, so I know it's comfortable because I never sleep. So I just lie there going, wow, what a comfortable mattress. I wish I could sleep sometime. Now, they shipped directly near the U.S. with free shipping, 120-night sleep trial, limited lifetime warranty, meaning you can test it risk-free and send it back if it is not right for you. I absolutely love it. I've had my helix mattress for years and multiple helix mattresses. In fact, I'm such a good father. I've gotten them for my kids. Go to helixleep.com slash friendly fire 27% off sitewide.

wide. Make sure you enter our show name after checkout so they know that we sent you. Helixleep.com slash friendly fire. Now, before Bati was so rudely interrupted by that advertisement, we can get back to her point. What I was going to say is, yes, on the far right and the left, you see a similar kind of blame the Jews for everything. The Jews are all pedophiles. The Jewish state is undermining American interests, et cetera, et cetera. But I really kind of dispute this horseshoe theory because a horseshoe suggests that they're equal, but they really aren't in terms of the mainstream, which is I think what Drew was just pointing to. The right has done, in my view, an admirable job of telling these guys like Thomas Massie, This party has no place for you. Trump, Kicktucker and Megyn Kelly and Candace Owens out of the party, basically. They have all been excised on my show. You've had congressmen, senators. members of the cabinet saying, what happened to Tucker Carlson? I would be surprised if Tucker Carlson is at the next RNC. And while they're doing a really good job on the right of excising this, the left is just allowing it to metastasize. They're turning the very same people into celebrities and really elevating their profile, campaigning with them, mainstreaming their views. So if I may just do a short plug for my book, The Jews and the Left, they're not... not the same. These are not the same. You've got one side that is deeply committed to saying we stand against anti-Semitism. You're allowed to criticize Israel, of course, but we are not going to allow Jew hate to infiltrate and become mainstream. And the other side, which is saying, actually, no, this is the price of entry now. Like the word Zionist is a full-on slur. I agree with that, you know, I think that's true. I think the Republicans have been much better about this than the- They definitely have. So speaking of brutalizing the left, are we about to just take out a 150-year-old communist dictator in Cuba? Has anyone been, I actually, I've been kind of out of the news. Could happen, yeah. They're threatening to prosecute Raul Castro, right? I mean, I think that that's, so presumably that's the precursor to maybe we go in and kidnap him and fly him in a track suit. And you just hope that, you know, whoever sponsors that track suit has really paid top dollar for it because Nike made bank off of that Maduro track suit. So if we're going to do this in full capitalist fashion, we don't just go and take Raul Castro. We get an endorsement deal. And then we put him in a Reebok. track suit and really make some money back for the American people. Spread it out a little bit. Well, listen, before we get into it, even though Batya, I'm certain would look much better in a track suit and really anything else than Ben Dominich would. We unfortunately have to say goodbye to Batya. We have to bring on Ben Dominich. I have no say over it. The producers make me do it. Batia, wonderful to see you as always. Everybody should go watch Batia's show and follow her all over the place. Thank you. Thank you for having me. God bless and protect you all. Take care. Good to see you.

So, you know, we're talking about Thomas Massie's future prospects. I mean, one of the other things here is that if you go out in a blaze of glory shouting about how you've started a movement, maybe you run for president or sponsors over at Calci are estimating like 36% odds that Thomas Massie tries a 2028 presidential run. Not totally crazy. Honestly, I think that that's actually, that might be low because somebody is going to have to try and be the avatar of the psycho, well, great movement. And it's not going to be, I think, Joe Kent or Marjorie Taylor Greene. A Thomas Massie Marjorie Taylor Greene ticket, man, that could do serious double digit. numbers of voters. Well, there's also just, that'd be huge. Look, on the, just on the libertarian point, I mean, put all the other controversy aside, if Thomas Massie's going to be Mr. Libertarian, there's always some guy doing that. You know, Ron Paul would run for president. Rand Paul has already signaled he does want to run. And Thomas Massie would have some juice to do that. So there is that lane. The other thing that's kind of interesting, because Thomas Massie's now a Republican. I think he's still a Republican, who's in opposition to Trump, is if Trump is doing really, really well, you saw Marco Rubio once again saying he would back JD, Trump reasserting control over the party, if it's like JD Marco Rubio, if that ticket, they keep floating from the White House, if that's the ticket, if Trump's doing really, really well, there you go, you got it. But if the Trump administration does collapse for whatever reason, then the Republicans who are going to have a better shot are the ones who are not tied to the administration. So all of a sudden then, the Ron DeSantis, candidacy starts to look pretty interesting, assuming he doesn't join the admin, or I'm not saying Thomas Massie or Rand Paul are going to be president, but all of a sudden, they actually do get a little boost to their prospects. Yeah, but this is the place where Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez comes in. This is my nightmare that the Trump administration really tanked, which I don't think it's going to do, actually. I think it's going to come out of smelling like a rose. But if it does, I think Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez is the most dangerous person in the country. The woman is a pretty, an idiot, and a fascist. I mean, it's an almost perfect combination to win over the left. Mr. Dominic? You're in and we turn back to the other Ben. Why are you bringing me on? You could have kept her. I know. I know. She's so much nicer than you are, Ben. She's like, I'm so much nicer. Can I make one more point about the Thomas Massie thing before we turn to Cuba? Because frankly, I'm much more interested in the Thomas Massie thing than the Cuba thing, to be honest with you, because nothing's happening in Cuba until it actually happens. So I want to get your guys' take on this. They're kind of... It's very weird that Thomas Massie decides that he's going to steer directly into crazy land. He was like hanging with Chank Uyghur and Anna Casparian the day before a Republican primary in a bright red district in northern Kentucky, right, which is political dumbassery of the highest order. Libertarians are like this. They just think they swing left sometimes.

Oh, no, no, they're totally psycho. I mean, this is why their convention is the best watching TV, right? I mean, every four years their convention is some fat dude with an iron cross dancing around without a shirt, followed by some naked chick talking about how pornography is the most American thing. It's an amazing place, the libertarian convention. But in any case, here's the question. I had three possible theories as to why Thomas Massie did this. Theory number one is the most obvious, which is Trump decided that he was going to punch Thomas Massie as hard as he could in the face. Thomas Massie did not want to blame Trump, so he blamed the Jews. Right, which is a typical thing. You see Tucker Carlson do the same thing where he says, well, you know, it's not Trump that I'm upset with. It's his puppeteers. It's the marionette masters who are really doing it. And those marionettes, the people who are handling all the strings, that's the Jews. So a great way to avoid hitting Trump in a race where Trump is hitting you is to say it's really not Trump is people who are being manipulative of Trump. So that's theory number one. Theory number two is he knew he was toast, so he was going to steer directly into podcastistan and try to make himself his next career. And again, we talked about that before. I think that's quite plausible. And then theory number three is that people like Thomas Massie, spend an awful lot of time online and you just get brainworms. And once you get those brainworms online, it is very difficult to excise them in real life because let's be real. Again, this was a district in northern Kentucky in which Thomas Massie made his number one issue, a small Middle Eastern state halfway around the globe. Which is, again, only understandable if you have brainworms or if it's on purpose or if it's on purpose a different way. So I kind of want to know which theory of those three you buy. I'll give a more charitable view, which is it. How did it start? It could have started from a real principled opposition to wars in the Middle East. I actually think it might have started a little earlier than that, but let's say it started there. There's no doubt that a ton of pro-Israel Jews really wanted to get Thomas Massie out. And Trump, you know, again, we were talking about it earlier, but I think Trump was really the factor that made the difference. But nevertheless, it could well be the case that even if Thomas Massie didn't start out, like... smacking at the Jews or, you know, he obviously had his Tel Aviv comment last night. It might just be the case that when he saw that his big opposition was going to be coming from pro-Israel Jews, it just accelerated whatever trend was going on there. You know, in other words, like, he had a problem. So it wasn't strategic, it was emotional. I think it might have been emotional. Can I, can I make a vote here for brainworms? Can I make a vote here for brain worms? Because I know. I know who Thomas Massie used to be. And he basically was this, like, hippie libertarian who was also somebody who would, you know, build these chicken coops and make them controlled by Bluetooth and stuff like this. He was just sort of weird and eccentric. But he really was not leaning into any of the crazy stuff that he leaned in all the way up to this. And that's why it doesn't really, it makes no sense that he would, you know, steal the rocket ship directly into the sun, you know, based on prior behavior and the way that he was just kind of this, you know, this loner who was kind of off on the side, you know, and the fact that he would pair up with Ro Khanna to deal in all of this bullshit going after Trump. Look, there are.

Four things on my Mount Rushmore of hate. It's communist. It's anti-Semites. It's Karen's and it's hippies. And by the end of the day, he was hanging out with three or four of those and doing it all the time. So who does that? You know, someone who was a libertarian who has any kind of rural libertarian principle or something like that, who has the kind of pro-life record that Thomas Massie had, the kind of pro-gun record that he had in the past, stuff like that, you just don't anticipate him going in that direction. And so I think the last couple of years, of him, he just went crazy and he started hanging around with the worst of the crazies. I think my vote is for a combination of the two theories that one is the brainworms and he went crazy. It was exacerbated by the fact that Jewish money was pouring into the campaign against him. But also, people do tend to look for an exit strategy. And I wouldn't surprise me whatsoever as he started to go nuts, he started to see that little light at the end of the tunnel that ends up in podcastistan and making good money and with a big audience. So I think there might be a combination of the passion and the greed. Because he did seem to really lose his role personality. You know, if it is the greed, I think that that does speak to kind of where the Republican Party is. In other words, the anti-Semitism and the conspiratorial muddiness and sort of the Tucker Carlson wing of what's going on, that is an excellent exit strategy and it's a very poor entry strategy. And I think people are mistaking an exit strategy for an entry strategy, meaning that we've seen a bunch of candidates. who are endorsed by Tucker Carlson, who are getting their asses just handed to them in election after election, whether it's Casey Pooch against Vivek Ramaswamy up in Ohio. James Fishbeck is about to get crushed by Byron Donalds's down here. You have Thomas Massie, who's now lost his seat, Marjorie Taylor Greene has lost her seat. You're seeing this happen over and over and over and over. And so you're seeing people exit and presumably make more money and get the strange new respect on the other end. But if you're a politician who is looking to get into sort of a position of power in the Republican Party, Is your best way of doing that, like, as an elected official, to steer into Crazy Land? Or does it turn out that actually Normiland is the way that you get in, and Crazy Land is the way that you get out with money? No, that's a good observation. There's also one sort of emotional aspect here, because my theory is still, like, a lot of this was exacerbated emotionally and kind of understandably. But the part that we haven't talked about is he started to fall a foul of Trump and get a little bit more eccentric than usual. Right around the time his wife died. I mean, to what degree is this just his wife of decades died and he got kind of emotionally unmoored and it upended his political career? Is that too much psycho babble for political analysis? I don't know him well enough to know that. I just know that he became unrecognizable to a lot of us who interacted with him over the years. He again went from being this kind of, you know, country libertarian type who was always smiling and kind of happy and knew that he was basically irrelevant. to being someone who was aggressively going after the most important person in politics, in America, not just in his party, and doing so in ways that repeatedly involved him lying blatantly about all these sorts of things related to the Epstein files, as Ben was saying earlier. So I think that there is something to that, Michael, but, you know, I haven't had him on the psychoanalysis couch personally. You're right. It's interesting, though, that the...

that Tucker Carlson's lack of influence is the exact opposite of what Tucker Carlson himself predicted and that almost everything that Tucker Carlson predicts turns out to be the opposite, which I think is proof that God is a gigantic, invisible Jewish man with a long white beard. I think he's just screwing with Tucker Carlson. Either that or it's just the demon. I actually, like, looking at the way these things have shaken out here, there are two things that make me feel really good about it. One, even, again, it's like, I'm not a huge Thomas Massie hater. I think for a lot of his career, he was great. It just irritated me when he was really turning away and kind of, I don't know, opposing the party and the president. But nevertheless, the two great affirmations are one. Twitter's not real life. Sometimes I worry about that. Sometimes I think maybe Twitter is becoming real life. But no, there's a huge distinction between those things. And... There's a big chasm between the hardcore politics on the ground and the political media. And so, you know, if the podcasts conducted the election, the results would all be different, but they didn't. You know, it was conducted by voters in districts around the country. And we have so many data points. We have the Indiana data point, which, again, that issue was redistricting. We have the Georgia data point. That issue was really the election of 2020. We have Bill Cassidy. We have that data point. We now have Thomas Massie. So it just, it seems to me that the Guard rails hold and politics is actually a little different than the entertainment products. If we had a political media, that was a all interesting. I have to break in here. I have to break in here with a smooth segue into a policy genius commercial. And as soon as I think of one, I'll tell you what it is. But I think the important thing is like I could go, look, I could go at any minute. In the middle of this conversation, I could just fall off my chair and this gone. And I want to make sure that the people that I care about, you know, there's only like one or two of them that they are taken care of. And I think for all the stuff we remember. We often forget that that's an important thing. What happens to your family when you keel over and die, which could happen to anybody at any minute if I have anything to say about it. The responsibility of protecting your loved ones is heavy and trying to navigate life insurance on your own can be a mess. Our sponsor, Policy Genius, makes that process easier by acting as an online insurance marketplace, not an insurance company so you can compare quotes from some of America's top insurers side by side for... free. Their license team works for you, not for the insurance carriers, so they care about your needs, your budget, your family. They help you figure out coverage amounts, prices, terms, all of it. So there's no guesswork, just clarity. What do you guys do? I mean, you guys don't care about your families. So you probably haven't used this stuff. I mean, I have an enormous amount of life insurance on me for very obvious reasons, like hundreds of millions of dollars of life insurance on me. And so I definitely understand the necessity for life insurance, but even if you are just an old man living alone at the end of your life like Drew, well, you know, even you need policy genius.

Absolutely. Policy Genius will answer your questions, handle the paperwork, and advocate for you throughout the process. They've already racked up thousands of five-star reviews from people just like you and possibly like me. Nobody else is really like me. Protect your family with a policy that grows with your life. With PolicyGenius, you can see if you can find 20-year life insurance policies starting at just $276 a year for $1 million in coverage. Head to PolicyGenius.com slash fire to compare life insurance quotes from top companies and see how much you could save. That's policygenius.com slash fire. Man, if Drew could get a 20-year policy for that kind of price, my goodness. As long as I don't have to have a whole checkup, because I never blast those for some reason. So I just wanted to add, if you made a comment about political media, I think that if we had a functional political media that wasn't just interested in carrying water for the Democrats, the narrative after last night would be that Republicans are way more unified than Democrats are. Over the course of the past couple of months, we've seen. Democrats prevail in multiple primaries. We've seen the situation play out in Maine. We've seen the election of Zohran Mamdani. We've seen all of these different situations where the DSA-backed candidate, the Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez-backed candidate, has prevailed over people that the Democrats have actually preferred or the establishment has even an noignant on their side. And nobody's talking about that story in the legacy media because it's an inconvenient story and it's actually true. The fact is that they're only united by the fact that they all loathe Trump. just a contest of how much they loathe them between them. And that's, I think, the real story of what's going on on the left today, which is far more divided than the right after everything that's played out in these primaries. And it's clear that unity really is a political virtue. You know, I think one of the real points of pride for Thomas Massie, and it's a point of pride among libertarians, is they love to point out how different they are, how they're willing to stand up to their party or how they, I don't know, how special they are. They love that, you know, individualist political ideologies do that. But unity really matters. You know, it's one of the four marks of the church, per the Nicene Creed, and it's important in your home, it's important, you know, in your country. And it's certainly important in political parties. Not just, look, you don't want to blindly follow the leader of a party and the Republicans do a bunch of dumb things that we should, you know, try to fight against. But I can't help but going back to this clip that has been going viral of a journalist with an activist outside New York courthouse talking about Luigi Mangione and the killing of Brian Thompson. And this girl said, you know, his kids are better off without him. It's this guy, you know, he deserved to die. And, you know, those kids, they can enjoy the blood money. And what I keep coming back to, and we've seen this time and time again, obviously. with Charlie's assassination and with the near assassination of Trump is that the left, mainstream swads of the left, have been telling us for over a year now.

really for much longer, that they would want to kill us and we'll mock our kids when they have succeeded. They keep telling us that. And in the face of that, we need party unity, not to be lemmings, not to be blind followers, not to be NPCs, but we can duke it out in the primaries, but then we need to get in line, follow the leader, and win elections. And to your point, Ben, I think that that really comes out pretty cleanly last night. There is a clear leader of the political party. There is a clear... party apparatus, funding, media, organizing, and looking ahead to the midterms in 2028, the stakes are very, very high, and I'll take unity as a virtue. I mean, I agree with that, but I think that what happened here and what's been happening is that there are lines drawn, right? Unity has to be around a thing. Right now, the unity in the Republican Party is around the thing of the Trump administration. Right. And so you can say, well, you know, Thomas Massie was more of a principled conservative when it came to spending, which, by the way, I agree with. I was very praiseworthy of Thomas Massie's positions for most of his career when it came to the role of the federal government, for example. But the reality is that there were lines that were drawn. And then Trump is legitimately excising people from those lines. He's not just saying, blanket unity come hug me. He's saying, listen, here's where the line is. And if you're on the other side of that line, you're on the other side of that line. The point that you're making about the Democrats is a good one. It also is demonstra. They have embraced the worst parts of themselves. I mean, legitimately the worst parts of themselves. Hasan Piker talking about social murder with the New York Times, about Brian Thompson. And then Hasan Piker, no shock, endorsing people like Abdul El-Sayed, the Senate Democrat would-be nominee in Michigan, who's probably going to end up with the nomination. There's like a full-scale terrorism supporter. And by the way, Hasan Piker endorsing, wait for it, Thomas Massie. Again, so there is this horseshoe that has taken place. But I think his earlier point is right. The part of the right wing horseshoe that is horseshoeing is being actively excised from the party by President Trump, which is a pretty amazing thing, actually. You know, it's always the theory of the guys on the furthest edge of a party that if they would only allow them to do their thing, they would win everything. The Democrats are going to test that theory. I mean, they've been testing it. And these DSA guys are going to get out there. And it's going to be interesting to see how much, you know, leverage they have because there is a move to the left. in a younger cohort of voters who usually don't vote. So we've been safe from them. But they do get excited over a guy like Zohran Mamdani. I think he is the only politician that I think of is actually being evil, Zohran Mamdani. I think he's an actual bad guy, you know, an actual one. Only one. Pretty big. Well, I mean, there's a lot of corruption, a lot of that stuff. But this guy's an actual destroyer. Platteners. Graham Platner's legitimately evil. I mean, some of the stuff that Graham Platner is posted. He's not in office yet. I was talking about office holders. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure. No, I know what you mean. But Graham Platner is, again, another guy who's being fully endorsed and legitimized by the entire Democratic Party infrastructure. You have members of the Democratic media who are out there massaging a guy who was saying on Reddit like a couple of years ago about how happy he was to watch a video of an American military member literally being killed. I mean, he is...

Graham Platner is disgusting, disgusting. And the Democratic Party is hugging him with both arms right now. I mean, legitimately saying, I mean, there are people who are saying that he should run for Maine Senate and then he should run for president. And the only saving grace of Zohran Mamdani is he wasn't born in America, so he can't run for the presidency. But Graham Platner can. And there are a bunch of people in the Democratic Party who are rising. And the next generation of the Democratic Party is psychotic. I mean, fully damned crazy. Like they are not remotely anywhere in the neighborhood of the sane. And so, you know, I get asked the question a lot. Do we think that there's going to be a reversion to a sort of normal politics after this? I mean, the only way that that happens if the Democrats get absolutely shellacked. And I think that, unfortunately, because of the polarized nature of the political system right now, the chances that they get totally shellacked, pretty low, actually. Yeah, I agree. They don't have to get shellacked in the midterms, though. They just have to do badly. Yeah, the demonization thing that Michael was just talking about, I think we need to really consider and take it seriously. I think people have kind of, they've joked about it. It's starting to turn because of Luigi and Gianni, because of a number of attempts on Trump's life and, of course, because of Charlie's assassination. But I think, like, I don't know why it hasn't gotten more attention that there have been multiple attempts on Sam Altman's life, that like the AI phenomenon is now creating. and the demonization of billionaires that Bernie Sanders talks about, that is echoed by so many, not just on the DSA left, but just on the left generally, that that's going to create a climate in which... These people, they're not going to be able to live and work and have the kind of roles as captains of industry that they've had in the past without having the fear of the kind of backlash that these radical demonizing elements of the left really, I think, believe in, truly in their hearts. And that's something that is so evil and so atrocious in terms of American history. We've seen things like this happen in the past, and it led to... bombings, it led to assassination attempts, it led to things that were absolutely terrible for our fabric. And to see this happening in the 250th anniversary of America really is depressing to me. Well, one of the things that actually is unique, and Ben, you're pointing it out here, is that in the history of the United States, when there are assassination attempts, typically it is people who are involved directly in the business of politics, right? It's Robert F. Kennedy Jr. getting shot or MLK getting shot, or even Charlie, in the line of MLK, right, just being a political activist and not to say they were saying the same thing or anything. But the reality is that it is now extended out to almost Russian revolution-style violence, like going after people.

who are just captains of industry, as you say, people who are running companies, people who are just engaged in the marketplace, like the actual marketplace. If you had said to me 15 years ago that there would be an assassination attempt on the president, I said, okay, that's kind of like, unfortunately, a relative norm in American political life. Even if you had said to me there would be an assassination of a high-level political activist like Charlie, I said that that's unique and horrifying, but not totally unexpected. If you would say to me that we would be at a point where... You know, people like a Jeff Bezos or a Mark Zuckerberg or a Sam Altman, that these are people who have to walk around with 24-7 security for the crime of creating products and services that people want to buy. And these are the bad guys now. The United Healthcare CEO is now considered the bad guy, engaged in quote-unquote social murder. You're talking about true Russian revolution-style revolutionary violence directed against an entire class. And that's scary stuff. I mean, that is a completely different thing. And also, these are all soft targets. Ben, we should also point out, this has happened before, and we kind of forget about it in American history. But you think about the pomerades, you think about the early part of the 20th century. You had anarchists and communists who were setting off bombs on Wall Street, who were setting off bombs and shooting people in the Capitol. You had a Marxist professor from Harvard, 1915. Of course it was Harvard, shooting up or setting off a bomb in the Capitol. You did have these kinds of anarchist bombings about almost exactly 100 years ago. You're seeing them begin to crop up again. The last time that that happened, the federal government came in and curtailed civil rights and put these people in prison, deported these people, got them out of our country. Whether or not we have the ability to actually exert that kind of political authority or the desire to do so right now, I'm not so sure. But we have seen this play out before. And the only way that we were able to survive it right around the time of the Russian Revolution when Russia did not survive it is because we wielded... federal authority in a very, very strong way. And if we don't do that now, I fear that the problem won't resolve itself on its own. Well, we'll get to more on that in just one second. First, we need to talk about, you know, how you talk. And I mean, like, actually talk, like on your phone. One of the weirder financial habits people have is you will spend hours comparison shopping for a plane ticket that saves you like $12. And then you'll continue paying $80 or $90 a month for wireless service without any question. And at a certain point, you have to ask yourself, why am I doing that? Especially now that companies like Pure Talk exist. Pure Talk is veteran-led. It's backed by 100% U.S.-based customer service and now offers unlimited high-speed data for just $3499 a month. It's a pretty major shift because unlimited high-speed data at Peartock used to start around $55 a month, but Pure Talk has continued pushing to offer more value at lower prices. So if you looked at Pure Talk before and you didn't make the switch, well, that was double of you. You should have done that. And now you should probably take another look. One thing people always ask is whether the service holds up compared to the massively overpriced major carriers. The answer is, I mean, it's yes, but you should try it yourself. Pure Talk lets you test the service for 30 days with no contract and no cancellation fees. There's really pretty much no downside to seeing whether it works. for you. Knowles, I know that you have been using Pure Talk. How has your service been? I absolutely love it. I've had my Pure Talk phone for about six years now. The customer service is great because they speak English and they speak it in a normal American way. But, too, it is actually the best service in the country. A lot of people hear that and they think, oh, you use similar towers, similar coverage. You know, no, no, it is the same towers. It's the same coverage as the best places in the country. And you can even take it overseas if you're going on vacation this summer. So it's just phenomenal. I could not possibly recommend it highly enough.

Well, take it from Knowles. It's the one issue I trust him on. The switch itself can happen in as little as 10 minutes. And again, if you need help, that U.S.-based customer service team is standing by. Head on over to PureTalk.com slash Josh Shapiro. Claim unlimited high-speed data for just 3499. Again, that's PureTalk.com slash Josh Shapiro to switch to my wireless company and Knowles' wireless company, Pure Talk. We're saying goodbye to you, Mr. Dominic, because you don't have a doctoral degree, and we are replacing you with Dr. Oz. Good to see you, sir. Like all of us. Good to see you, Ben. I'm an honorary doctor, so if anyone ever has a heart attack on an airplane, I'll say, hey, hey, hey, who needs a commencement speech? I'm here. I got you. I'm totally recovered. Do we have Dr. Oz with us? There he is. Dr. Oz, good to see you, sir. Good afternoon, everybody. How are you? Doing very, very well. I know we're all here just babbling and cackling and giggling, whereas you are not only helping to lead health in the country, but also rooting out all of that terrible fraud, which we have not talked enough about. Well, maybe they can put in the context of affordability, because I think for a lot of Americans, it's what they're most concerned about. And if you just took the fraud out of Medicare and Medicaid, and we estimate there's probably $100 billion of fraud on the programs that the government pays for you to get better health, that would allow us to double the life expectancy of the Medicare trust fund. So to put that in context, if you're working your tail off right now and watching the show, and you're worried Medicare was not going to be there for you when you reach the ripe old age of 65, it's the parachute that's going to catch you. and deal with your health issues without costing you an arm and a leg, so you can keep your arms and legs, then you should be pretty much with us on this fraud issue, because by doubling the life expectancy of the program, we'll make sure it's there for you and for your grandkids. And that's the kind of discussion we need to be having in earnest with each other, because the fraud is so large, is so weaponized, that we have to start asking ourselves, is this really a flaw? for state leadership for governors, or maybe there's a feature here we had not noticed before, which is why they've allowed it to go unimpeded for so many years. Can you explain what kind of fraud is taking place exactly? I'll give you three examples. So South Florida, where you guys have some affinity, is a state that has generally done okay on fraud, waste, and abuse, but in the area of durable medical equipment, where, you know, the wheelchairs and canes, these companies have now grown so quickly that we have twice as many of these durable medical equipment suppliers as McDonald's. in South Florida. It's impossible that that many people want to sell you wheelchairs. But that's the norm. We think the Cuban government's involved, as many of the perpetrators actually flee back to Cuba. Even worse, one-third of all hospices in the entire country are in Los Angeles.

not California, and actually specifically the city of Los Angeles. Now, that would imply a very high death rate in L.A. And no matter what we might say about Los Angeles, that's not the truth. And so if you have one third of all of the hospices taking care of people at the end of their life with dignity in one city, then we would have to assume most of those folks are fraudulent. In fact, half of the people in Los Angeles, the hospice centers, we do think are fraudulent, and we have stopped paying almost half of them already. And here's the craziness of all this thing. 800 of these hospices we've stopped paying. We've had maybe two dozen complaint. So most of these guys say, all right, gigs up. You know, they came looking for a man. We know one day we'd be out of business. We're going to go defraud somebody else. But the fact that that could have occurred under the watch of Gavin Newsom, even though he was warned four years ago by the state auditor general that there was widespread fraud and really just did performative things to pretend he was dealing with the crisis. Why should the federal government have to come in and clean up the mess? Well, unfortunately, it's federal dollars they're spending. So literally, New Mexico, another blue state, and Mississippi, a red state, their tax bills are higher because those folks who don't have the income of people in California are paying extra federal taxes so we can transfer it right to Los Angeles, where the unmitigated disaster of fraud, not just in hospice, but in other programs exist. Let me give you a third example. And then we can come to the why question, which is always the most important one. New York City, New York State. These are, you know, big, prosperous areas. The number one job growth, in fact, the number one job of all in New York State. is a personal care service attendant. Now, what does that mean? That means we're paying someone to carry your groceries up the stairs to your kitchen. That person is often your child or the neighbor's kid, and your neighbor's kid's driving you to the doctor's office. So all these services that historically your family would do for you, we're not paying someone to do for you. It's become a jobs program. Let's take it to the why question. Why would it be that you would allow that much growth? Why is California have... twice the amount of money being spent on these same personal care services than the national average. It's because if you're not making jobs yourself and you want to pretend like you're creating jobs and you want to be able to get federal tax dollars to pay for those jobs and then tax that income so you have more state revenue, well, you create personal care services. It's literally exactly what they have done in New York and in California. And here's the part that's really getting made. They're unionizing those workers. which means we're going to help the union that's the big service workers union. And New York double in size. All that union dues and all the taxes on that, that all flows back potentially for political patronage purposes to support the single dominant party in New York State and California. So, Dr. Oz, other than sort of the rooting out of the fraud that's happening, what systemic changes do you think need to be made to how the federal government deals with Medicaid at the state level? I know there have been a lot of critiques of the Block Grant program because it basically removes a lot of the incentive for states to actually police their own fraud because if you're just getting a chunk of change, it doesn't really matter to you whether or not you identify the fraud or not. The chunk is the same. What sort of systemic changes do you think need to happen?

Oh, this is very addressable. First of all, you need a federal government that wants to do their job. The prior administration gutted the Medicaid program integrity. There were, and I'm going to be clear about this, there were six people left that we're aware of that were working in Medicaid program integrity for the country. at CMS, the agency that I run for the president. And that basically means we're not serious about this. We just want you to enroll as many people as possible into the Medicaid program. We don't want to hear about fraud. And that's what I was told by people who are here, because they were told this and just, you know, go do something else. Just don't focus on the fraud issue because you're going to create a narrative, a micro narrative that doesn't agree with our administration policy. But you also have to have states that want to work with us, and we need an all-government approach. So what the president did by appointing JD Vance to be the head of this White House Anti-Fraud Task Force, and we've been doing announcements as you've been witnessing frequently highlighting these realities, is if I've got a problem at CMS, and I'm the insurance company, and I see that there's some aberrancy in payments, we've doubled or tripled the payments in an area, it doesn't make any sense. I can go to DOJ. FBI, the Office of Inspector General, and they're going to actually work for me, with me, rather, and take charge of this issue to actually investigate crime. Or I can go to Scott Bessent in the Treasury, and he's going to actually use forensic accountants to find out where's the money getting laundered to? Like, who are the big players involved? Because it turns out we have foreign... groups that are involved in organized criminal activities and foreign governments, we believe, that may also be involved in these endeavors. These are not mom and pop setups. We need at all of government effort. And finally, governors have to feel the pressure. Governor Walt stepped down. in Minnesota because of pressure over the massive amount of fraud that he was unwilling to take charge of when he was governor. We had the governor of Maine is now stepped down. Others may as well. If your governor's not willing to do their job, you the people should be upset because you're compromising your people and your state programs by not taking charge of the fraud. Medicaid has to be run by the states. Medicaid, therefore, should be matured and nurtured and for good reason protected by state leadership against this kind of fraud. And if the federal government has to step in because our tax dollars are being abused, it's not going to be a happy day. To what degree is all of this fraud organized? To me, with my political cap on, that's what's most interesting. Not just that some scam artists are trying to bilk the system, but that there is a system of patronage that has politicians not just looking the other way, but really in some ways cooperating with it. You mentioned Governor Walls. There are plenty of accusations there. So how organized is this? And how...

Who can we bring to account, not just for stealing some taxpayer dollars, but for setting up a system that's fundamentally unjust? Well, I just interviewed a whistleblower yesterday from Minnesota. She worked in state agency. She's a Democrat, by the way, was raised a Democrat, was a Democrat. And as soon as she began raising concerns about the fact that there was a disproportionate amount of money being taken by the Somalians in Minnesota, she was quickly ostracized and blocked off. And she said the big problem there was they did not want to be perceived as racist. They want to be Minnesota nice. And that doesn't mean that you literally blind yourself to the reality of criminal activities, but because she was willing to call that out, she was ostracized. And I think that's part of the puzzle. that people aren't willing to just do the right thing. Part of it is they recognize that by doing the right thing, they might actually look worse in the eyes of their voters. Some people may not like the fact that you're going after criminal entities. And these are dangerous groups that intimidate witnesses. If you go to Flushing Queens in New York, you're not going to get any of the Chinese folks who live there to talk to you about the fraud that they're witnessing. But we know there's tremendous amounts of fraud. Human trafficking, by the way, lots of other bad things. Because once you tolerate corruption, it spreads widely. But there has to be... a change in expectations. Many states have normalized fraud. Now, think about this. If it's okay for a doctor to lie about a patient needing hospice by claiming that they're going to die when, in fact, they don't have any problems whatsoever that are immortal or even near immortal, they're selling their soul. And what we have allowed to happen and it got worse during COVID, when there was a general belief, you could just throw money at the problem and hope it worked out. And then a lack of policing of program integrity over the last administration's tenure, you're left with a system where fraud is normalized, where corruption is what's always out there. So you're looking for your little handout. Like many countries that have fraud, it's systemic. Everyone gets a little piece of the action. Everyone dips their beak into the equation. But I was told this by a friend of mine, and this is a profound statement. made. They said when Republicans win the White House, everybody wants to be the Secretary of Treasury. Everybody wants to be the ambassador to England. That's what Republicans seek. When a Democrat wins the White House, they want to get control of healthy human services. Because that's where the big money is. Our budget's almost $2 trillion. And that money flows through many systems where all you need is a beneficiary's identification number to serve as a credit card. You can take advantage of the system. So we have got to create a world where taking advantage of our most vulnerable Americans is no longer acceptable.

Yes, we need to do that. Two things I really desire. I would desire to totally clean up HHS with all of this fraud. I would also desire to be the ambassador to England. That sounds like a great job. Dr. Oz, we've taken up enough of your time. Thank you very much for coming on the show. Thank you for everything you're doing. And Godspeed on this very important task. Now we turn to a man who every day goes by will more likely need health care coverage. And that is, of course, Andrew Plavin. This Memorial Day, and I remember the first Memorial Day, this Memorial Day weekend, get 45% off an annual Daily Wire Plus membership. That's too nice for these people. God, here's what you get. Exclusive member-only content like Real History with Matt Walsh, which has new episodes every single month. And frankly, we've got a lot more coming. Shows you haven't seen. Content you haven't heard about yet. All exclusive to members. This is the time to join 45% off DailyWire.com. Do it today. Or else. Do it. Do it right now. That's what I'm going to leave you on. Just go do it. I don't want to put any distraction in your head before then. And I hope everyone has a good Memorial Day. Good to see you, gentlemen. See you next time. You've got to you too, Michael. Good talking to you.