The News Roundup For December 12, 2025

This message comes from MintMobile. If you're tired of spending hundreds on big wireless bills, bogus fees, and free perks, MintMobile is for you. Shop plans at mintmobile.com slash switch. Taxes and fees extra. See MintMobile for details. Hey, it's Todd, your host for this edition of The News Roundup. Just a quick heads up before we start the show. The news is constantly changing and things might have changed by the time you hear this episode. Stay up to date with the news by listening to your local NPR member station and by visiting npr.org for all the latest. Thanks for listening. Enjoy the show. You're listening to the 1A podcast. I'm Todd Zwillick, and this is the News Roundup. This week, a dissonant tone in America from our president talking about Democrats. You know, they always have a hoax. The new word is affordability. From the average American. I just don't know how anyone is doing it right now. Everything is so expensive. The Fed, the Federal Reserve, cut rates for the third time in three months, farmers. suffering under Trump's trade policy could see some bailout money. And more sobering jobs news comes out of the Labor Department. Now, President Trump's handling of this economic moment is showing up in his approval ratings. A new AP Nork poll says approval of Trump on the economy and immigration are down 10 points since March. Overall, on immigration, Donald Trump's term-defining policy. Just 38% of Americans say they approve. AP has Trump underwater by more than 20 points. So voters are noticing, and so are lawmakers in Washington and in the states. This week, Republicans in Congress know that concerns over the economy is... No hoax, and they voted to overturn Trump's order taking away collective bargaining rights for federal workers. And in Indiana, they ignored the full arsenal of threats from Donald Trump and his allies to vote down his demand to draw two more GOP-friendly House seats. With all of that is where we're going to start. This week, we'll connect the dots on all of the big stories from around the country with Steve Clemens, editor at large for the national interest. Hey, Steve. Good to be with you. I saw you waving there. You got to say, hi, you can't just wave on the radio. Hi, Taylor Poplarz is in studio so he can wave national political reporter at the White House for Spectrum News. Hey, Taylor. Hey, Todd, great to be here. With no wave. That's how you do it. And Alana Shore, senior Washington editor for Semaphore. Hi, Alana. Thrilled to be here. So let's start with that stunning defeat that I mentioned for President Trump in Indiana. 21 Republican senators joining Democrats to reject another mid-decade redraw of the Congress. congressional map for more GOP seats. The 21, the other side, you know, we felt a little bit more traditionally that perhaps, you know, that we should look at this redistricting as, you know, not quite as transactional, that this is something that happens every 10 years. And we feel it should continue that way. We don't want to.

be redistricting every two years at the whim of a president's request. That was Republican Indiana State Senator Mike Boeachek talking to CNN after the vote. The overall vote in the GOP-dominated Indiana Senate, 31 to 19. And Alana Shore, there is Republican, Indiana State Senator saying they don't want this to be transactional. They don't want to redistrict at the whim of a president's request. Now, Trump... threatened to primary Indiana Republicans who voted against this new map. We just heard from one, but what do we know about the nearly two dozen other Republicans who voted against this and why they did it? Well, for starters, it got a lot worse than primary threats. There were reports of swatting, sending authorities, law enforcement to these people's homes. Some of these lawmakers reported that their kids were getting texts and comments about this. It got alarmingly personal. And it's important to note that these 21, who you say, that's a majority of Republicans in the India State Senate, that's... That's huge, especially given that the president and vice president are out there depicting them as some kind of a rogue minority. It's just not the case based on the numbers. And a lot of them, you know, they were citing the Constitution. They were speaking to their personal values in a really deep way because, frankly, the supporters of the president's plan made it personal. Taylor Trump also threatened to cut off Indiana's share of federal funding if Republicans didn't vote his way on redistricting. They did it anyway. You know, six months ago, eight months ago, this story would not be told this way. This is different. One of the themes this hour, the president's loosening grip on the GOP, is this an example? It definitely is an example. Building on what Alana said, Vice President JD Vance traveled to Indiana twice as part of this pressure campaign. There was also a response from National Democrats, Pete Buttigieg, who now lives in Michigan, but of course came to fame as the mayor of South Bend, where I started my reporting career. I lived in Indiana for three years. He traveled back to the state capital in Indianapolis and held a rally about this. So this had a lot of eyeballs on it. And on Thursday night, after the vote, the lieutenant governor of Indiana, who is a Trump supporting Republican. and was pro redistricting, he tweeted that the Trump administration was very clear about this, that they would lose federal funding if they didn't support this. And then he said, then he deleted it by Friday morning. And so there was an acknowledgement there, though, that the president was trying to kind of play old school mafia style politics with this. And these state senators in Indiana didn't want to deal with it. They didn't feel it was appropriate. I want to draw a line under what you just said, that it was confirmed. by the, you said the majority leader or the lieutenant governor, that the president said you will lose taxpayer public money if you don't do my private political will. Yeah. Isn't that the definition of corruption? I screenshoted his tweet and people could.

I'll read it verbatim. The Trump admin was very clear about this. They told many lawmakers, cabinet members, and the governor and I that this would happen. The Indiana Senate made it clear to the Trump administration today that they do not want to be partners with the White House. The White House made it clear to them that they'd oblige. That was last night after the vote. So very clear. And President Trump has made no question about it. He has said to all of these states, Republican-leaning states, that he wants to redistrict. He's basically like, I'll help you guys out. If you help me out, if not, I'm going. going to cut you off. And federal funding is now at stake when it never has been with redistrict. Another word for federal funding is taxpayers money, not Donald Trump's money and not maggot ink's money. Steve Clemens, so redrawing efforts that we've covered, Texas, California, Missouri, North Carolina, they've all been approved with advantage for Republicans and Democrats mixed in. What does this all mean for the midterms at this point? What do we know about the math? Well, right now the math is really interesting in that all of this may happen. And we've got to note that in Missouri and North Carolina, there are serious pushbacks and serious effort. But let's just presume that all of the deals go through. And then you even add into that, you know, Florida, Maryland, Virginia. And now we take Indiana out. And you basically have pretty much parity in terms of the number of seats. If they were all to go in the direction, you know, the Democrats would probably get a net plus nine seats and the Republicans around 10 or 11. So for all of this anguish about redistricting, you know, mid-term. you've got very, very little gain for it because of the steps, particularly with what Gavin Newsom did in California to balance what Texas was doing. It's all awash. It feels like a trench war. It's a wash, but like to move an inch in a trench where you have to sacrifice a lot. And it seems like that's what's been going on. Meanwhile, Out of the trenches. Well, this is trenches, too, but an actual electoral politics where voters get to actually vote. Let's go to Miami, where there was some more momentum for Democrats this week. In a Tuesday runoff, Miami elected its first female mayor and its first Democrat in 28 years. Former County Commissioner Eileen Higgins beat the Trump-backed Republican, Emilio Gonzalez, with 60% of the vote. Here's Higgins after her win. You have the combination of the sad. politics of trickle-down hatred that is menacing our immigrant population, and they were ready for change. President Trump won Miami-Dade County by 11 points in last November's election. Alana Shore, the mayor's office in Miami is supposed to be nonpartisan, but what can we take from this result? Well, we can take a really positive sign about this, quote unquote, affordability campaign that Democrats want to run. Eileen Higgins was an Abigail Spanberger style problem-solving candidate, didn't really throw a lot of partisan red meat, said I want to fix problems. She's a huge city planning nerd, and she was coming out and talking like she wanted to help everyone, and that really, really resonated. She connected it very much to the cost of living concerns that Democrats want to run their entire midterm campaign.

on. I will make one note, though, given that, you know, I spent some time in Florida too. Miami-Dade County, it did go for Trump, but Miami itself, the city does still have a slightly higher number of registered Democrats. So it's not, you know, necessarily a huge world-beater that she won, but a super positive sign for the type of candidacies the party wants to focus on. Meanwhile, you go just a bit north into Georgia. Another special election win for Democrats on Tuesday. Democrat Eric Gisler flipped a state house. seat President Trump won Gisler's District by 12 percentage points in 2024. So that flip. So Taylor, just stepping back, zooming back from this a little bit, Democrats flipped about 20 state legislative seats last month in those off-year elections. Here's another one down in Georgia flip from a plus 12 Trump district. Talk about the momentum overall or the electoral picture as we understand it right now. When you zoom out, whatever party is in power, especially in the White House, the first election cycle after they've assumed power, they usually face hurdles. And the opposing party has momentum on their side. So in many ways, this is traditional and is standard. What's intriguing about some of these very state-specific or local races, again, these are off-year races where turnout is really dependent on that community, people's availability, how much interest both locally and nationally that race is getting. So you can't read too much. into the tea leaves there. But what is interesting, and I think the Indiana redistricting story ties into this, is there is clear frustration. There is some form of a ceiling for Republican Trump voters to what the president is doing and what he is focusing on and prioritizing. And to Alana's point, this mayor elect in Miami, focused on affordability. We saw President Trump go to Pennsylvania this week to talk about affordability, but he strayed far from that topic and once again called it a hoax. So that's something Democrats are paying attention. We're going to talk about the president's message on affordability. We'll talk about what he talked about in Pennsylvania and whether the president can stick to that affordability message. He's... They're dragging him kicking and screaming all the way on that issue, and he doesn't seem to want to acknowledge it, much like President Biden didn't want to, and affordability was a problem for him. We got this message from Joseph in Indiana on the issue of Republicans there voting down President Trump's demand on redistricting. Joseph says, I know this is a low watermark in politics to have to say this, but I'm proud of my Republican state senators for understanding that representatives do not choose their voters. but the other way around. Joseph, thanks for that comment from Indiana. We're rounding up all of the week's news. Stay with us.

This message comes from Jerry. Are you tired of your car insurance rate going up, even with a clean driving record? That's why there's Jerry, your proactive insurance assistant. Jerry compares rates side by side from over 50 top insurers and helps you switch with ease. Jerry even tracks market rates and alerts you when it's best to shop. No spam calls, no hidden fees. Drivers who save with Jerry could save over $1,300 a year. Switch with confidence. Download the Jerry app or visit jerry.a.a.a. slash NPR today. This message comes from designer shoe warehouse. You know that feeling when you find shoes you love at a great price and want to tell everyone about it? Find something to brag about at designer shoe warehouse, like the latest styles from brands you love, the trends everyone's obsessing over, and shoes that make you feel like you. Head to a DSW store or DSW.com today for shoes that get you at prices that get your budget. DSW, let us surprise you. All right, back to the roundup. We have a little bit of breaking news as we talk about the economy in the state of the country, new photos and documents from the House Oversight Committee Democrats on Jeffrey Epstein and the Epstein files. This is breaking as we're on the air. But Taylor Poplars, what do we know? So the Oversight Committee released what they, it says they received 95,000 new photos from Jeffrey Epstein's estate. And they, as they've done in the past, they've sorted through them and are kind of highlighting the ones they think are the most telling. They've released just under 20 photos at this point. President Trump is featured in at least three of these photos. It's him with Epstein, what looks like social functions. There's one photo of him standing in the middle of a group of women whose faces are blacked out, presumably by the Oversight Committee. committee. And then there are some photos of other powerful men who have, we know, have had associations with Epstein from former president Bill Clinton to Bill Gates, the billionaire, to a former president of Harvard, Larry Summers, who has recently kind of stepped back from public life as his ties with Epstein have come into fruition. The other one that I'll point out that's interesting is a photo of what appears to be novelty condoms that have, that say, Trump condoms, and have the president's face. I don't know what year this was from clearly before he was in office, but it just goes to show that the president and Epstein did have a relationship as we knew. And it seems like there were at times, you know, plays on their friendship and enough to have something like this at an event. But the committee is releasing these. They're saying that it's time for the White House to end what the Democrats are calling a cover-up, and they're asking for the White House to release the files, which Congress, of course, recently voted to do it. Right. The Democrats, of course, want to keep the story, the pressure, and the narrative going on the Epstein files as they await the release of what the Justice Department has in the Epstein files. We should just say before we move on, this is not that. This is not the Epstein files at DOJ, right?

Yeah, this is from Epstein's estate that Congress has been working with for a long time and has been kind of getting a drip, drip of information. People think of it, could think of it as an onion. There's multiple layers of Epstein-related material that different aspects of the government and lawyers have that is being released at different times. Okay, we'll put the Epstein files aside for now. Have a strong feeling we're going to be coming back to it before too long. But they always say, you wouldn't know it from the continuing release of the Epstein files, but they always say it's the economy, stupid. Whether you're stupid or not, it's still the economy. It doesn't matter how smart you are. It's still the economy. It shines on us all, as they say. Now, on Wednesday, the Fed cut interest rates again, third rate cut in the last four months. Steve Clemens, what did Jerome Powell say about why now and why are Fed governors divided? on the federal interest rate i think they're divided because there are different signals that are that are out there in the economy you've got a slowing uh labor market slower hiring you had a downward revision of over two million jobs of previous release in that but they have not tamed inflation they still worry about the ongoing impacts and instability and anxiety uh from inflation over that and so it was a one of the most um divided votes from the Fed that we've seen in a very long time. So interest rates have come down. And some of the interests, you know, those that were four more, wanted a much bigger drop. Now, this week, President Trump did something that he's barely done at all. In his second term, he went out to pitch his policies directly to the American people, the primary purpose to calm concerns about the economy and affordability, as we already mentioned. But in the speech, in Pennsylvania, he ranted about windmills, about Somalis, and yes, his words, shithole countries, while standing in front of placards, reading bigger paychecks. They use the word affordability. And that's their only word. They say affordability. And everyone says, oh, that must mean Trump has high prices. No, our prices are coming down tremendously. We got this comment from Stephen who says part of the disconnect is explained by the K-shaped economy, which we've talked about here on 1A. For some people, everything is still affordable. That's just not the experience of most people. So Alana Shore, we heard the president there. We heard the comment from Stephen. What's the message here? The president has been calling affordability a Democratic con job. He's claimed he brought inflation down. Broadly, he's brought prices have fallen. The idea that prices have fallen broadly is false. We mentioned his approval numbers dropping. What do we know about Trump's approach and how it's playing with people suffering this economy, including his Republican supporters there in Pennsylvania? Well, we actually had the White House Deputy Chief of Staff in Semaphore for an event recently, and his response was very fascinating. He sounded to me a little bit like John McCain, for those old enough to remember when he famously said before the financial crisis, the fundamentals of the economy are strong.

He actually said, James Blair, the fundamentals of the economy are good. Now, that's highly debatable. But what Blair went on to tell us, and he is one of the president's top advisors on his message, is they believe they can walk this line of telling Americans you're going to feel better next year. We get it. We feel your pain now. It's tough out there. Forget about the president's calling a Democratic hoax. You know, he's just mad at them. Once you get your tax refunds, the effect of these tax cuts we passed are going to make you feel so much better. That's kind of how. his advisors are seeing or rather maybe hoping how things will go, that's a risky bet because the polls show voters are unhappy now. They're feeling the pinch now. And telling people wait till tax season isn't really going to cut it. Well, even as the president dismisses economic concerns and this. buzzword of affordability at his rallies. There's also an acknowledgement of a kind. The president announced a bailout for farmers who've been hurt by his trade war. Steve Clemens, what are the details about how much money this is, how it can work, and why now? Well, it's $12 billion in total and about $11 billion of what they call farmer bridge assistance. This is really designed to take, you know, to farmers that have been shocked by tariffs, farmers that have lost markets. These are mainly row crop farmers for soybeans, corn. wheat, cotton, rice, etc. But in this, these are for aggregate farms that are under $900,000. So these are smaller farmers, and they're capping the amount that a farmer can get about $155 grand. So when you kind of do some back-of-the-seat math, most people think that the payouts would be around $100,000 on average. You've got about 120,000 farmers that they're looking at, which is a ton of farmers. That's a lot of people out there that have been screaming about. you know, lost economic activity and markets that have just disappeared overnight amidst these tariff wars. So that's what they're doing. They're hoping to get the first payments out by February, but it's designed to set them up so they can survive into the next season. Well, we got this from Marion in Michigan, who says, what leverage does Congress have over how tariff revenues are dispersed? In addition to the farm bailouts announced this week by Trump administration, Republican senators are asking for additional bailouts for farm equipment manufacturers like... John Deere, who've also been hit hard by tariffs. I'm confused. Why doesn't Congress just demand Trump drop the farm tariffs as a condition for the bailouts? Taylor? This Congress in particular does not, even though it's Republican-controlled Congress, they do not stand up to the president a lot. They've shown this year that they've been very willing to have him be in the driver's seat in more ways than any president typically is, especially when it comes to both taxpayer funds and revenue streams like coming from tariffs. And so because the president has prioritized so much of his agenda on tariff revenue, these Republicans don't really want to try to get in his way in terms of their vision of this. And many of

them, even though they're hearing from their constituents, many of whom are farmers and they're saying, this is not good and we're not wanting this. As Steve mapped out, they're saying, well, we're going to trust the president because he claims that this is working and that it'll all end up helping people. Well, there is an acknowledgement of a kind in a $12 billion bailout for farmers for tariffs. Tariffs were billed over and over again as cutting prices, great for the economy, great for everyone. When you write a $12 billion check because people are hurting. There is an acknowledgement there. And the irony is that the president, when announcing this $12 billion package, he said that this is because we've made so much money from the tariffs, what he did not mention is that Americans are the ones paying for most of these tariffs because they are charged at the port of entry. So in many ways, these are Americans helping bail out American farmers. Well, you don't get as much solid data as you need about the state of our economy lately. A lot of it's been delayed in some cases not available at all. But we did get some information this week in the form of what's called jolts. Jolt stands for job openings and labor turnover survey. Alana Shore, what did we learn from the jolts? We learned some very interesting figures. The most interesting contrast to me is that job openings are really rising, reaching, I believe, a five-year high going from $7.2 to $7.7 million. And that seems like it's good news, right? There's more job opportunities for people. But instead, the quits rate, which is what actually measures how much people are moving around. is hitting near lows, 1.8%. So there are all these jobs open, mostly in trade and transport, like, you know, less easy to move around in jobs, and no one's taking them. Everyone's scared and they're staying put. Now, the layoff rate also ticked up a little bit. Overall, the report wasn't horrible, but they're kind of what I would call warning signs. Well, the economy is being felt in Indiana and in rally halls in Pennsylvania. It's being felt on the farm. It's being felt in the White House, although in a different way than those other places I mentioned. And it's being felt in the halls of Congress. Let's talk about how lawmakers, especially Republican lawmakers, react when they feel that kind of pressure. As fractured as the House is these days, one bipartisan bill. did pass on Thursday. It was a bill to reinstate collective bargaining rights for nearly one million federal employees. Collective bargaining rights, 20 Republicans voted with Democrats to support that bill. And what it did was it overturned a Donald Trump executive order stripping federal workers of collective bargaining rights. Taylor Poplars, why did the president's party split with him on this issue in the House Republican-controlled House now? So I think you have to look at who was spearheading this, and it's a Pennsylvania congressman named Brian Fitzpatrick. He's a more moderate Republican. He represents Bucks County, Pennsylvania, which is right outside in the Philly area. It's a classic kind of swing county that gets a lot of attention every election cycle. But if you look at the Republicans who joined him, I think of, because I used to cover Ohio lawmakers, Congressman Mike Turner from the Dayton, Ohio area. These are areas that have had large union populations, both past and present.

And they were not on board with this president, with President Trump's executive order. And so this was an effort to stand up so that they can both politically say to their constituents in these, you know, more manufacturing-centric areas, look, I'm trying to pursue this for you. The reality is that it's probably dead on arrival in the Senate. So this isn't going to strip the president's executive order. But it is in a year when Congress has been so willing to just do what the president wants, it was notable. Steve Clemens, like with redistricting, I think this is similar. Six months ago had this vote come up. up in the Republican-controlled House, you would not have seen 20 Republicans voting to overturn it against the wishes of Donald Trump. So what's changing? Yeah, you're seeing cracks in the president's power and you're seeing... Real, you're seeing value calculations, interest calculations by other Republicans, particularly moderate ones who are trying to explain the situation, trying to explain, you know, some of the mercurial behavior from the president who are now beginning to resist and push back. And you're able to count in ways you couldn't six months ago, real rollbacks of what the president wants, where he wants to go. It's not lame duckism, but it's beginning to approach something like that as we get into 2026. And people are fearful when they look at these off-year elections that they could have a huge title wave of Democrat. I wouldn't even say because of the Democrats, but just anti-Trumpism in the body politic. Well, that's the House. Let's talk about the Senate and Donald Trump's. prospects. We've been talking about his cratering presidential approval ratings on a variety of issues. The things about those approval ratings, lawmakers, yes, they read them too. Any elected member of Congress who says, I don't read the polls, that is a lie. Yes, they do, and they act accordingly. So let's talk about the Senate, a couple of health care bills, two opposing health care related bills on the floor of the Senate. Affordable Care Act enhanced subsidies that you've been hearing so much about. That was the issue, and both of those bills failed. Alana, Republicans have been promising a health care plan, not just for weeks, not just for months, but for many, many years. Do they have any unity on a plan now, keeping in mind, of course, that enhanced ACA subsidies expire in just a couple of weeks? Short answer is no. And, you know, that's for the predictable reasons. Trump has not weighed in. Trump has been very dismissive of concerns related to the subsidy as much as he's been dismissive of affordability. But, you know, cut out the noise from the divisions in the Republican Party. And what I find most striking about what's going on right now is more and more Republicans are starting to admit, oh, we made a huge mistake. Maybe. Maybe we should have cut a deal before now because, you know, open enrollment is almost over. And you're hearing that come out in people like Roger Marshall, a pretty conservative senator from Kansas, who told us at Semaphore this week, I think we're going to try to get a bipartisan deal in January.

I mean, that kind of stuff is wacky given the political intensity and the partisanship that we saw. But it's not surprising, Todd, because four Republican senators backed the Democratic plan. It was the more bipartisan alternative of the two. Alana, I noticed that Senator Dan Sullivan of Alaska, a Republican who's up for re-election, voted for the Democratic bill, a three-year extension of enhanced ACA subsidies. That's notable because Dan Sullivan is one of the guys who voted over and over again. to repeal Obamacare over the years. Now he's up for election, and here he is voting for more subsidies. What does that say? It says a lot, especially when you see the other Alaska Senator Lisa Murkowski, who's some, you know, in the party derided as a rhino, kind of leading the charge. Okay, we're going to take a quick pause here. We'll be back with more of the week's biggest headlines. Just a moment. Stay with us. This message comes from Jerry. Noticing your car insurance rate creep up even without tickets or claims, you're not alone. That's why there's Jerry. Jerry handles the legwork by comparing quotes side by side from over 50 top insurers so you can confidently hit buy. No spam calls, no hidden fees. Jerry even tracks rates and alerts you when it's best to shop. Drivers who say with Jerry could save over $1,300 a year. Don't overpay. Download the Jerry app or visit jerry.a.ai slash NPR today. This message comes from designer shoe warehouse. You know that feeling when you find shoes you love at a great price and want to tell everyone about it? Find something to brag about at designer shoe warehouse, like the latest styles from brands you love, the trends everyone's obsessing over, and shoes that make you feel like you. Head to a DSW store or DSW.com today for shoes that get you at prices that get your budget. DSW, let us surprise you. This week on the NPR Politics Podcast, we uncover a pattern in political ad spending. As the midterms get closer, Republicans are leaning into an issue they've won on before, immigration. We look at their message and also what Democrats are saying on the issue in a very different way. Listen now on the NPR Politics Podcast. All right, back to the roundup now with our expert panel. We were in the halls of Congress before the break. Let's stay there just for the moment because lawmakers this week put a provision in their annual defense policy bill that says Congress can withhold a quarter of Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth's travel budget until he releases unedited videos of the September 2nd. boat strikes, the very ones that have been controversial for potentially illegal orders, you might know them by the epithet double-tap strike. The bill is expected to pass both chambers of Congress this month. Now, the video has been shared with some members in both the House and the Senate on the national security committees and the intelligence committees. And lawmakers from both sides of the aisle appear to be split on whether the video depicts what the administration claims it does.

two combatants who are, quote, still in the fight. That's what Arkansas Senator Tom Cotton had to say when he saw the video. Other lawmakers, including many Democrats, say that's absolutely not true that these were two people clinging to wreckage in the middle of the ocean when they were hit with a second strike. Steve Clemens, if more lawmakers see the video, a wider audience, and if the public sees the video, what kind of consensus, what kind of pressure could emerge from that? Well, look, I think if the video were to be seen by more legislators across the aisle, I think they realize that this video is likely to make its way into the public domain. And as that happens, people will be making values decisions. What I find very interesting is you listen to Senator Cotton's take that he saw nothing wrong, that this was the government doing what it should be doing. You listed Representative Jim Himes, who said it's one of the most disturbing videos he's ever seen. Senator Rand Paul has already out there basically saying these are summary executions and murder. And he is still in the GOP. And so when you kind of look at that broadly, I think many legislators are beginning to ask, what if this makes it way into the public? And many military families who tend to steer conservative have very, very strong feelings that you do not kill. You do not. It is my father was in the military. It is embedded deeply that you do not take the kind of actions that Jim Himes and others are asserting. that Pete Hegseth's command staff took. So I believe that as it gets seen more, it will probably build a consensus. And you have to remember at the beginning of this, Donald Trump himself came out and said, show the video, I have no problem. And then he deferred to Secretary Pete Hegseth and said, do what you want. And so many people are beginning, you know, this feeds conspiracy theories that Pete Hegseth is trying to cover up. Well, one, he's trying to shove the admiral out in front and blame it on him, but also cover up something from the American people. The president at first said, released the video. I have no problem when a reporter asked Trump about that statement. He denied having ever made it. Of course, it was made on video. So you had the before and after. He absolutely did say it. And then... Backtracked. Alana Shore, what's the conversation like behind the scenes in Congress? A lot of lawmakers reacted privately also when they saw this effort from many weeks ago from Democratic national security members, Mark Kelly of Arizona and others, the illegal orders video applying pressure to this issue. What's the conversation like? I think it's actually splitting between the House and the Senate. Perhaps honestly because of Kelly's central role, you're seeing Roger Wicker, who's the chair of the Senate Armed Services Committee, kind of not back down in terms of wanting to investigate further, wanting more information beyond what's been included in this bill, imperiling funding if they don't comply. However, in the House, Mike Rogers, his counterpart on Armed Services is kind of, he's satisfied.

We'll put this provision in the bill and we'll kind of move on. Now, that's not surprising. It wouldn't be the first time the Senate put up more of a fight than the House. But we'll have to see how serious Roger Wicker is about this, because there is more investigation to be done, according to Democrats. All right, we go from Capitol Hill back to the White House. We got this question from Dan. In the past month or so, we've seen Donald Trump become more erratic and more insulting to reporters asking reasonable questions. falling asleep multiple times in public appearances, and he slurs words can't even track with his own party's messaging. Why hasn't the mainstream media been as ruthless with Trump's effects of his age in his first year of term as they were with Biden in the last year of his term? Now, the New York Times says this week that it will keep reporting on the president's health, even after the president called the publication, quote, true enemies of the people for doing so. Taylor Poplars, what has the Times reported on recently? And what do we know from your vantage point in the front row at the White House? about the president's health and the effective aging on his body. So we know that this coming June, President Trump will turn 80. He came back into office as the oldest ever president, slightly older than when Joe Biden was sworn in for his term. The Trump administration has been very sensitive to any questioning about the president's health, his abilities. We know that he's gone to Walter Reed Medical Center twice this year for various physicals and examinations. It eventually came out that he got an MRI. And there have been. more questions about that because the White House hasn't disclosed full details about why that was conducted, what it was looking for. And he talks a lot about the cognitive tests that he's been getting. He says he aces them as though their intelligence tests, but cognitive tests aren't given for fun to people his age. No, and he has claimed he's taken three of them, but we don't have a timeline for when they've been taken, and the White House has not released any record of sort of those results. The president released a very, very... very lengthy truth social post ranting and complaining about this attention on his health he did the new york times story was extensive and it talked about his schedule which president biden's schedule was scrutinized because he operated mostly in a five to six hour window during the day i'm at the white house every day i could tell you you know when the president is in the west wing because a marine is standing outside of it On average, if the president is here in Washington, he shows up in the West Wing between 10 and 11 a.m. And he is there usually later in the day. But the Times looked at that. It looked at his comments. It looked at the fact that his hand has been photographed a lot recently. He is bruising on his hand. He covers it up with makeup. There are bandages on it. The White House says it's because he takes a daily aspirin and he shakes a lot of hands. But medical experts question that. That does not pass the smell test. I've personally been in the room with the president when I've seen him start to doze off at events. is happening more than it was in his first term as he's getting older um that extended truth social post from the president on his health and jimmy kimmel joked that the post actually has more than

twice the number of words as the Gettysburg address. I checked. It does. More than twice the length of the Gettysburg address. I believe he also said in that post that it is treasonous for news outlets and seditious to question his health. And given the very legitimate concerns and feedback about the lack of coverage of President Biden's age and abilities, it's only fair that President Trump receives it when he's around the same age. All right. Let's move from the White House back out. to the states in America, the effect of Donald Trump's immigration crackdown on communities across this country. Start with a fallout from the federal immigration crackdown in Minnesota. Over the last two weeks, DHS has disclosed 19 ICE arrests in Minnesota, but it won't disclose exactly how many people it's detained. On Wednesday, Minnesota Democratic Governor Tim Walz. demanded Secretary of Homeland Security, Kristi Noem, review those arrests after reports of at least two United States citizens being detained by ICE. One of those citizens was 20-year-old Mubeshire, who only wanted to use his first name. He was arrested while on his lunch break in Minneapolis and detained in a federal building. He says he wasn't allowed to show his passport for hours. He spoke at a press conference with Minneapolis Mayor Jacob Frye and Minneapolis Police Chief Brian O'Hara. All I did was step outside as a Somali American and I just got chased by a mass person. The agent then at one point he didn't identify himself. He didn't say, ice, stop. Like, I felt like I was being assaulted. I was getting kidnapped. And that's exactly where it was. Taylor, President Trump has spent the last two weeks disparaging in ugly and racist terms, Minnesota's Somali community of about 80,000 people, the vast majority of whom are American citizens. Not that that matters. How has the latest immigration enforcement been playing out on the ground in Minneapolis and across Minnesota? So like we've seen in many other states where the Trump administration has been conducting these enforcement operations, it does create fear amongst community members. It does create a chilling effect of sorts. That gentleman who you just featured talking about he was out on his lunch break and got detained and it was hours before he could even show his passport that he had on him to prove his citizenship. That is having a ripple effect. We're seeing the mayor of Minneapolis, the mayor of St. Paul, the governor of Minnesota, all Democrats, they're coming out and sharply disagreeing with the Trump administration. on this. But to your point, the president's remarks especially about Somalians here in this country, as you alluded to, most of which are here legally, have been really stunning, and it has shown that the president himself has a dislike for this sect of people, and he wants them removed. He's openly saying that. He's saying Congresswoman Ilhan Omar, who is a U.S. citizen duly elected, should not be allowed to serve and should go back home to her home country. And the Department of Homeland Security seems willing to carry out that mandate. And also at that Pennsylvania rally standing. in front of placards that said bigger paychecks, the president mused about why we can't have more immigrants from places like Norway and Denmark and Sweden places filled with white people. That was Donald Trump's wish standing in front of placards that said,

bigger paychecks. And he confirmed a 2018 story where he called African countries assholes, which after denying it, after he and his administration vehemently denied it in the first term, and somebody shouted it out at this Pennsylvania event. And he said, oh, yeah, you remember when I told the senators that? And all of us who cover him are like, oh, my gosh, you just confirmed that. So his views are very clear on this, and the Department of Homeland Security is willing to carry it out. Well, also this week, a federal judge ordered the release of Kilmar-Abrigo Garcia, the Maryland resident, who became a symbol. of Donald Trump's mass deportation campaign. He was released on Thursday. Abrago was wrongfully deported to El Salvador in March. Of course, he was released and then arrested again and had been held in detention in Pennsylvania since June. The Trump administration was trying to deport him to Liberia where he has no ties. Now he's free. Steve Clemens, could this be an end of this saga of detention and release for Abrago Garcia? Not a chance. Essentially, the judge also acted to preempt an immediate redetention order. The authorities have already said they're going to appeal the judge's decision and try to take this up to get a re-evaluation of the kind of core reasons for his detention and expulsion. So that's going on. He also has legal proceedings against him in Tennessee regarding human smuggling and conspiracy charges in Tennessee. That legal issue will continue. And he's still going to have to continue to be supervised by ICE, though not detained, and have regular meetings under supervision of ICE. So his encounter, his, you know, face time with ICE is going to continue. And you're going to have the legal dimensions of this continually battled. And we won't know for quite a long time whether or not. Abrago Garcia is free from further detention and free from this process. But at this moment right now, it doesn't look like it. Meanwhile, the ACA... ACLU and other civil liberties groups put out a list of what they say are abuses faced by people in ICE detention in Texas. The ACLU says that four Cuban immigrants were driven to the border with Mexico told to cross it or face violence and imprisonment. The ACLU also says 45 interviews with detainees at Fort Bliss detention camp in El Paso yielded stories of beatings, sexual violence by guards, DHS's denies. denied these accusations. What do we know, Alana Shore, about the ACLU's warning here and what it says about how ICE is engaging in third country deportations and how they're treating detainees? Well, what you didn't mention is that one of these detainees die of liver and kidney failure, according to the ACLU, after failing to receive appropriate medical care. So the allegations being raised here are really, really serious. And, you know, they'll have a political impact. Obviously, you're already starting to hear talk about Kristi Noem.

potentially being forced out of the cabinet amid dissatisfaction. You know, the president says nice things about her, but what is happening here is an agency that got, what, $90 billion, I believe, in that tax cut bill is throwing a lot of money into operations that are allegedly committing serious abuses, and they will be litigated. One more story I want to check in before we go. It's Netflix pursuit of Warner Brothers media, which includes CNN. Now, you know the story. Netflix wants Warner Brothers. Paramount, also in a hostile fashion, wants Warner Brothers. Donald Trump. wants to see wants to make sure that cnn is sold steve clemens we only have a couple of seconds here but just put it into context the president of the united states saying he's going to dictate the terms of the sale of one of america's most important news companies one that he's called the enemy of the people It's a huge assertion in a very unconventional way of presidential authority where there's no place for it. You have a process of reviewing these mergers and acquisitions in the country, looking at how they test the monopoly status and whatnot and how this affects consumers. And these are controversial bids. The problem is Jared Kushner's involved in backing one of them. And you've got, you know, it's very controversial. And the president's going to say, hey. I'm going to get to know these people and make this all about himself. So that's a problem. And his family's money, Jared Kushner, has backing of one of the private equity firms in that deal. Let that sink in and wrap your head around that. Thanks to all of you for joining us. Steve Clemens of the National Interest, Taylor Poplar's of Spectrum News and Alana Shore of Semaphore. We're going to head to a quick break now. We'll be back in a minute with the global edition of the News Roundup. Stay with us.

This message comes from Jerry. Many people are overpaying on car insurance. Why? Switching providers can be a pain. Jerry helps make the process painless. Jerry is the only app that compares rates from over 50 insurers in minutes and helps you switch fast with no spam calls or hidden fees. Drivers who save with Jerry could save over $1,300 a year. Before you renew your car insurance policy, download the Jerry app or head to jerry.a.ai slash NPR. It's the international edition of the 1A News Roundup. Can the United States legally seize a Venezuelan oil tanker or is it an act of international piracy? What does this latest move by the Trump administration toward Nicholas Maduro in Venezuela mean for the escalating pressure campaign on Venezuela? And here in Washington, the Secretary of Defense goes from denial to defiance over those boat strikes. We'll get to all of that this hour, joining us on the line from California. Akbar Shahid Ahmed, senior diplomatic correspondent for Huff Post. Hi, Akbar. Thanks for having me, Todd. Here in the studio, Friends of 1A, you know them, Joyce Karam, senior news editor at All Monitor. Hi, Joyce. Hi, Todd, great to be with you. And to Joyce's right, Jack Dech, defense reporter at Politico. Hey, Jack. Good to be here, Todd. Great to have you to our panel and guests are here to answer all of your questions from around the world. Send those to us, 1A at WAMU. Well, let's start this hour as we so often do in Gaza. Torrential rain from storm Byron swept across the strip on Thursday, flooding overcrowded tents, sheltering tens of thousands of families displaced by two years of war. Close to five inches of rain were forecast to fall across the territory. And local health authorities say at least three children have died from exposure to the cold. Sammy Yusin is a displaced Palestinian living in central Gaza.

It poured all night and we were flooded. I couldn't move out as I have an amputated arm and shrapnel on my leg that I can't wait in the water. I started shouting and asking people to help get my children out, but they couldn't. The food was spoiled and the tense canopy got blown away. I don't know what to do. The mayor of Gaza City says the rain cut off several roads. Some of them completely submerged municipal and civil defense officials say. They can't cope with the storm because of fuel shortages and damage to equipment. Hamas led authorities in Gaza say Israel is not allowing in as much aid as promised under the truce agreement aid agencies, say Israel is blocking essential items. Israel says it's meeting its obligations and accused agencies of inefficiency and failing to prevent theft by Hamas, which they deny. Joyce Karam, what has storm Byron exposed about aid shortfalls? since the October 10th ceasefire in Gaza. It's truly a devastating situation. It's the last thing thought that Gaza needs at this point. You have almost one million internally displaced. There is no infrastructure. These people are soaked. Their tents cannot hold appropriate shelter from the rain. So the footage we're getting, what we're hearing from Gaza is just terrible. I saw this morning that it's almost eight people died from the storm from. inadequate shelter. They're pleading with the Israelis to send more aid that's not happening. Part of this age should be tents, should be tools to prevent flooding. It's not happening. I mean, when you look at the picture, it's... Totally two different areas here. Israel, which has warned its citizens, has equipped its hospitals before the storm, and then the Palestinians who have nothing. And you mentioned the eight shortages. Yes, Israel is not sending as much as agreed in the ceasefire. The agreement was at 600 trucks. The Associated Press reported that it's around 450 that are arriving. question of food, we got this question from Mara in Pennsylvania who says Palestinians say they're looking for flour and other food stuffs that will allow them to prepare their own meals. Like others, I'm sure. I thought that the United Nations was back in charge of distribution of food and that 500 food trucks and 200 trucks with medical and fuel supplies would be resumed to be delivered daily. What's the real-time situation in the Gaza Strip? That's from Mara in Pennsylvania. Is the UN in charge? And what do we know about the volume of aid that's flowing? No, it's Kogat that's in charge. It's the Israeli organization, part of the Israeli military that allows what aid comes in and what aid comes out. The crossings are, the Rafah crossing is still.

closed. So what's been entering is minimal. It's obviously better than what was before the ceasefire, but it's nowhere near what Gazans need. And on the numbers, yes, they're falling short by almost at least 30% from the numbers I've seen. So it's just nowhere. to be enough, especially in the cold and winter season. Now, U.S. officials have confirmed that intense negotiations are underway to move to phase two of the U.S. negotiated peace plan in Gaza, a key element and a major sticking point calls for Hamas and other Palestinian armed groups. to surrender weapons to an international peacekeeping force. And senior Israeli officials have described this as a crucial aim warning that failure to achieve it could cause the truce to collapse. Senior Hamas officials like Khalid Mashal say they're trying to convince the Trump administration to follow Hamas' own vision on how to deal with disarmament. Jack Dech, what does that mean exactly and how likely is a move to face two looking right now? Well, getting to phase two will be like trying to eat soup with a knife as the old U.S. counterterrorism metaphor went. I mean, if you just look at the checklist of what needs to be done, Hamas has to return the last dead Israeli hostage still in their custody. There has to be an international stabilization force that doesn't yet exist to basically police and oversee this operation. And then after all of that, This force and the international community would have to go through all of Hamas's tunnels, all of their hidden arms caches, all of the underground bunkers. They have rocket arsenals throughout the strip. Only then do you get to phase two. So it's geopolitically difficult to negotiate all these things that still are blank slates. And does Amas have any incentive to enable all of the difficult steps that you just described in the tunnels, disarmament, decommissioning weapons? Well, remember when Hamas agreed to this deal, it wasn't quite a yes. It was a yes, but they didn't really fully agree. to disarm to basically remove themselves from being a contender in the future state of Palestine. So you have this situation where Hamas is kind of playing along with the checklist, but we're getting down to crunch time on some of the key issues. And it's really unclear where this is going to stand. Joyce. And the major obstacle here to Jack's point is sequencing. What happens first? Hamas is saying Israel has to draw. Israel is saying no, Hamas has the disarm. The Americans are saying we have to get an agreement on the ISF, on the international stabilization force. So there is no even an orderly implementation of phase two, and each side is playing the blame game. Hamas, you know, these leaders are sitting in Qatar, you know, and five-star hotels.

including Khaled, so they're completely contradicting each other at some point on what does this armament mean? We've spoken to a Hamas figure this week and what he's saying we can guarantee that we won't shoot at foreign troops that will enter Gaza and if they are in the cities. We may target them. Khaled Mishal is saying something else. So another issue around withdrawal versus disarberment is the yellow line, that line that divides the Gaza Strip under this peace plan. Israeli troops have pulled back in Gaza, staying behind the line that was meant to be temporary. Akbar, what's going on around the yellow line now? Israel's military chief told soldiers this week that it's, quote, a new border. for them that's not what's in phase one of the agreement or even in phase two is that just bluster or a new new dimensions that israel's trying to establish In a way, this exemplifies the basic problem the Trump administration is facing, which is that the U.S. is back to the future on so many of these issues, right? Hamas' infrastructure has clearly not been degraded over, you know, more than two years of hugely devastating war. So what have all those debts been for? The U.N. question of distributing aid, as your listener is asking about, has been an issue throughout, but we haven't seen the U.S. pressure Israel, and that's where this yellow line issue is a problem. too, because we're not talking in any way about holding Israel's feet to the fire on its agreement or thinking about these long-term problems. Why does the other line matter? It matters for Palestinians going back to their homes, for reconstruction, but most importantly, it matters for this question of, are we moving from war towards some kind of peace and settlement, which would involve no permanent Israeli occupation of the territory of Gaza? the Israeli military chief coming out and saying, we're going to keep 53% of this trip is a real indication that the Israelis aren't feeling the pressure to go towards that kind of settlement or that kind of bigger approval. And of course, we've seen President Trump enable Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu after pressuring him earlier this year. So there's a lot of echoes of the kind of failed U.S. policy all the way from Biden from the start of this war. Although Akbar, Donald Trump has a lot invested in this being. some kind of lasting peace. He's invested a lot in his ability to end wars. This is the most important one. So is there any pressure, any incentive behind the scenes that he's putting on Benjamin Netanyahu to not blow up this deal with a lack of leverage on Israel? Or is he happy to see things progressing as they are, which is this kind of very tense, very unstable limbo? Be feeling. reports of Trump pressing Benjamin Netanyahu heavily including on matters like hostages, including on matters, like increasing aid. But it's all been rhetorical, right? And where the US is leveraged with Israel really exists is military and diplomatic in terms of weapons and in terms of the cover it provides for the continuation of the war, that's never been in question. And in fact, when you see the Trump administration saying we're trying to get a pardon for Benjamin Netanyahu and defend him from the international criminal court, he's feeling pretty safe.

from a US perspective. And that shows in Israeli posture around the yellow lines back on the ground, doesn't it? Absolutely. It gets to this question of... will Benjamin Netanyahu kind of acknowledge that there has to be Palestinian autonomy, right? I mean, Hamas, of course, is playing its own game from a self-interested point of view, but will he allow any kind of replacement and substitute to Hamas to rise up within Gaza, which we haven't seen a willingness for. All right, gang, I want to stay in Israel or at least Israel adjacent for the moment because this week, Israel greenlit the construction of 764 more houses in three Israeli settlements. in the occupied West Bank. The United Nations has declared Israel's settlements illegal, and numerous UN Security Council resolutions have called on Israel to halt all settlement activity. That's going back decades now. Israeli settler attacks against Palestinians spiked during this fall's olive harvest. According to a UN report, there were at least 264 attacks in the West Bank against Palestinians in October, the biggest monthly total since UN officials. began tracking such incidents nearly 20 years ago. Now, these Palestinians in the occupied West Bank near Noblis lost their family, olive groves, to Israeli settlers who uprooted the trees and took their land. These olives are our lives. My great-grandfather planted them. They were meant to stay and provide for our families. I wish I didn't live to see this day. Israeli forces arrived with the bulldozers, leveled everything. They didn't leave any olive trees. Now, an anti-settlement watchdog group is accused the Israeli government of, quote, racing toward de facto. annexation in the West Bank. Jack Dech, what has Israel said about their ambition with this land at this point? It depends on who you talk to. I mean, the finance minister, Bezal Smotrich, has been sort of a key figure in all of this. He's come to the West Bank with sort of the maps of what he wants it to eventually look like, which certainly does look like more of a de facto Israeli presence there. We've seen the incidences of settler violence go up as well, which of course are not endorsed. by the central government, but that seems to be somewhat of a symptom of what's going on here. So from Benjamin Netanyahu himself, it's very much sort of this counterterrorism posture. We're preventing anything rising up against the IDF or Israel. But you see within Benjamin Netanyahu's cabinets, these factions that very much see the West Bank as long term de facto part of Israel, if not de jure. Akbar, is what Jack is saying about the... power structure and incentives within Benjamin Netanyahu's cabinet help explain why he's not doing more to rein in these attacks. What is the Benjamin Netanyahu government doing to rein in settler attacks and have they been holding back? You know, it's certainly relevant that there are far-right ministers who are very close to Benjamin Netanyahu in his coalition government, but I just encourage people to sort of look at the bigger picture here in the trend lines, which are there is no one.

on the Israeli political spectrum speaking about political rights for Palestinians in the West Bank. There might be folks who condemn settler violence, but the overall environment that's been fostered, particularly since October 7th, is one of an intensive crackdown. And in my reporting, talking to Israeli and Palestinian peace activists who've been out there in the West Bank quite recently, Dave said they anticipate the situation where I'm moving towards Gaza levels of atrocities, violence, displacement. You have 40,000 Palestinians who were displaced at the start of this year. In what was called a counter-terror operation, there's been no date given for them to return back to their homes. So, yes, there's factions and there's disputes over how quickly do we move towards this, but the overall... direction is certainly not towards a kind of peace and stability move, which I think is quite concerning for the US. It's concerning for regional powers because this gets again to the question of should people feel that there is a partner for peace on the Israeli side. Certainly there's always been questions about whether there's one on the Palestinian side. But looking at housing units, looking at the violence, much of which is actually carried out by the Israeli military, not by settlers, there's a lot of alarm. From Israel's border with the West Bank north to its border with Lebanon this week, the United Nations said Israeli soldiers fired at peacekeepers on patrol in southern Lebanon. The UN is partnering with the Lebanese standing between Israel. and Hezbollah there and trying to support a shaky ceasefire there as well. Israel's military launched air strikes in southern Lebanon earlier in the week against what they say are Hezbollah targets. Joyce, you've been following this story. U.S. broker talks were held earlier this month. I might have said before that talks were going on between Israel and Hamas, Israel and Hezbollah. They're not. They're going on between Israel and Lebanon. but Israel is still fighting Hezbollah in southern Lebanon. What do we know about these talks? And is there any hope of an expanded ceasefire between the two sides? Todd, it's really a big deal that we're seeing talks, direct talks between Israel and Lebanon. This is the first time in 25 years that we see such talks. Last time was the Madrid Conference 1990, 1991. So, in an essence, Lebanon is conceded and is sitting down with Israelis and holding talks on the stability of the South, on the ceasefire that's in place. The issue that Lebanon has that the Lebanese government has is it doesn't have that capability to disarm Hezbollah, which is enlisted in the ceasefire, which is in Maine, Israeli.

So what's on the table now, and the U.S. is pushing for that is maybe Hezbollah can move its weapons to warehouses. Maybe Hezbollah can withdraw completely from southern Lebanon. At the same time, what we are also reporting this morning is Arab governments, regional powers as well, such as Turkey, have communicated to Lebanon that if this doesn't happen, soon, Israel could go again in an open war. How weakened is Hamas now after the very public, Hezbollah, pardon me, how weakened is Hezbollah now after the very public cell phone attack? after Israel and the United States bombing of Iran, which is so important for funding an organization for Hezbollah. What's the state of the organization? It's very much weakened and not just militarily, but, you know, when you talk to people in Lebanon, people, even in the Shia community, they're fed up. They don't want to be involved in one war, another war, second war, third war. People are really fed up with this continuous cycle of conflict. Is it to a point that they're going to give up their arms? No. Has Israel changed the rules of engagement since 2007? Yes. Is this a pressure campaign that will continue? Yes. I mean, they've just... down airstrikes this morning. So it's a tough balance for Lebanon and Beirut is trying its best to navigate the domestic pressure from Hezbollah and that's coming from the outside. Three fronts around Israel that we discussed, Gaza, the West Bank and the border with southern Lebanon and Hezbollah operating there. Let's leave the region for the week and I'm sure we'll come back to it as we always do. and go to Venezuela now, as we said at the top of the hour, the Trump administration escalating tensions with Venezuelan leader Nicholas Maduro. The U.S. seized an oil tanker this week off the coast of Venezuela. That was on Wednesday. And the Trump administration says the tanker was transporting sanctioned oil from Venezuela to Iran. The Venezuelan government has called the seizure a, quote, blatant theft. and an act of international piracy. Now, Jack Dutch, the U.S. has sanctioned more than 170 vessels that it accuses of moving illicit oil from Venezuela. So why seize this tanker now? Well, the skipper had been involved in sort of a mass network of this type of sending of oil. So it'd been refueling with oil in Iran. It'd been taking oil from Venezuela. And now it appeared to be headed to Cuba. For the administration with the skipper, I mean, it's one of the last levers they have left, right? If you're Trump and you want to put the screws to Maduro without putting boots on the ground or missiles in the air, you've sanctioned.

pretty much the entire government. You've labeled Maduro himself as a supporter of a terrorist organization. You've cut them off from the U.S. financial system. So now they're applying the squeeze by basically taking over these ships. Is it legally fraught? You bet. But it's certainly another way, another tool in the toolbox that the U.S. has left, and it will take the courts a long time to try and figure this out. Joyce, the New York Times also reported from its own reporting that this ship had a history of misreporting, falsely reporting its location, with messing with the transponder that's supposed to say where it is located, that its location has essentially been false. What else do we know? And that's a practice. It's called spoofing. It's not just for the skipper. But in the case of the... Skipper, it was giving different GPS location. It was flying the flag of Guyana without authorization. It's operating, like, you know, many vessels operate in dark fleet environment. Like the Iranian vessels that go to China do the same thing. So it was attempting to hide illicit movements, which helps the Trump administration in justifying the raid that they did. But is this raid exactly about oil? Is it about, you know, we really want to implement sanctions? Well, the U.S. does not do this kind of behavior for Iranian vessels that are going to China. This is to, as Jack said, to squeeze Maduro to part of a pressure campaign to get Maduro out of office. Akbar, earlier this week, two U.S. fighter jets circled over the Gulf of Venezuela as well. What's the message there? One of the big concerns that experts have had about this entire Trump pressure campaign on Venezuela is not only its legality, which is strongly disputed, but the idea of blowback, right? The sense that even if you are saying Maduro is an illegitimate leader, we want him out of office, we don't think he's supportive of the Venezuelan people or US interests. By threatening and kind of boosting fear, are you just increasing the risks of Venezuelans will rally around him? And I think this broader message of this week with the fighter jets, with the tanker seizure, are really increasing that risk of blowback to U.S. policy on Venezuela. The U.S. has justified this by saying, look, these fighter jets were in what we describe as international airspace. Venezuela claims it as its airspace. There's a dispute there. But the broader message of kind of overwhelming pincer-like military pressure, I think, is really going to increase the sense of encirclement and the sense of the U.S. leaning into militaristic options, even as Trump administration officials have kind of indicated, maybe we'd see a diplomatic off-ramp here. I think there's a real concern that we're heading right into a military confrontation that no one sort of authorized. Meanwhile, a corollary of the increased pressure campaign on Venezuela. boat strikes in the Caribbean and in the Eastern Pacific. Secretary of Defense Pete Hegseth under pressure to release complete video footage of strikes against what the administration claims are drugboats in those two bodies of water, especially footage of that attack on September 2nd that killed two survivors. Jack Dech, what levers do lawmakers have to force Pete Hegseth to release this video now? And what do they hope to learn from seeing video?

in its entirety. I should say a couple of lawmakers have seen it, but the broad backbenchers of the House and Senate have not seen it. They have the ultimate leverage. They hold the purse strings. And right now, the NDAA, that's the authorizing bill that goes through Congress, the $900 billion Pentagon budget, is being held on a clause that it would withhold a quarter of Pete Hegseth's travel budget until Congress gets to see this unedited footage. And that's part of the push. from Senator Roger Wicker, who's an ally of the administration, but has basically been saying, we're not getting the full story here. We'd like more. In the House, you see a very different story, even though that bill is moving along. You see Mike Rogers, the chairman, very allied with Trump, basically going out and saying, we've heard enough from these classified briefings. We've gotten the justification we need. This is lawful. Lawful. What about the claim that these boats carry fentanyl or they carry drugs headed to the U.S. border, that this is essentially a terrorist operation? Is that something that chairman of the Intelligence Committee can rule on? How is that claim landing? I mean, it seems like from everything we've seen from the closed door briefings, from all of the evidence, these appear to be boats that are trafficking cocaine that comes from Colombia through Venezuela towards the United States. Cocaine, not fentanyl. Cocaine, and the argument has been this is a precursor or a gateway to get people hooked onto fentanyl. So you see sort of the evidence and the argumentation is quite thin in terms of what they're trying to push this on. Yeah, the economics of drug use do not indicate that cocaine is a gateway drug to fentanyl. No, I mean, it doesn't seem like the argument would hold up under intense scrutiny, but you sort of see varying levels of scrutiny, right? You see in the Senate a little bit more scrutiny, more of a push to hold DOD's feet to the fire, and then in the House, at least from the Republican majority, a desire to move on here. So in terms of the legality of these strikes, Akbar, you've been reporting on the office within the State Department that considers whether government actions are in line with international law. our own government indicating that these strikes in the eastern Pacific and in the Caribbean are legal. What my reporting has found Todd is that within the State Department when morale was already just hugely low after mass firings, the Office of the Legal Advisor, which was critical to all these discussions of international law, is facing a huge exodus. I've heard that about more than 60 people have left from an office that's normally somewhere between 200 and 300. A lot of these are experienced career professionals who have been doing this across administrations and partisan lines.

The State Department is part of the discussions between DoD, the White House, the Justice Department about these arguments. And I think the concern that I've heard from people at state and from outside legal experts is if you're losing this talent and you're losing this nonpartisan font of expertise, what does that mean for your decision making? This is actually the only office that's extremely focused on international law in particular, not just the US law. And so that's where you have a concern of has the US... got into a period where decision-making is being made from the president wants this, so make it happen, not what's legal, what are the bounds of where we could go. And I think this raises a broader concern of... Are there any sort of checks and balances anymore in decision making, right? When we've seen the Trump administration kind of trot out new justifications, particularly for this campaign, and not face up to scrutiny of either arresting people and trying to prosecute them or have a kind of more open discussion of a war against drugs or Venezuela. These closed door meetings, who's involved and are they really qualified people? Meanwhile, some dramatic news from the coast of Venezuela. Of course, Venezuelan opposition leader Maria Turina Maria Corina Machado left her country with the help of the United States, traveled to Jon Ossoff to receive the Nobel Peace Prize. She missed the ceremony, but she talked to reporters while she was there. Some people talk about invasion in Venezuela, the threat of an invasion in Venezuela. And I answered, Venezuela has been already invaded. We have the Russian agents. We have the Iranian agents. We have terrorist groups such as Hezbollah, Hamas, operating freely in accordance with the regime. Meanwhile, reporting from the Wall Street Journal on a dramatic scene in the open ocean, Maria Corina Machado, who you just heard from, secretly speared out of Venezuela to attend those prize ceremonies, rescued by an American extraction team on a skiff in the dark after losing their GPS transmitter, a dramatic scene, Joyce, reported overnight by the Wall Street Journal. Very dramatic and a big moment for Maria Corina Machado. We haven't seen her in public since January 9. She's been isolated. Some say she's... hasn't seen any people. So, you know, to see her in Jon Ossoff, to connect with people, she was very eager and hungry to do that. Now, the reactions back in Venezuela are mixed. Some say, oh, you know, she left the country. She's, you know, another exile leaders. But she has her base support, which is why Maduro blocked her from elections. All right, gang, I want to, as promised, visit Russia's war in Ukraine as... Peace efforts continue to limp along, if you can even call them that. Wednesday, Donald Trump spoke with European leaders, namely Francis, President Emmanuel Macron, Germany's chancellor, Frederick Merrittz, and UK Prime Minister Keir Starmer. Parsing through official readouts. Akbar, what did they talk about? What's the state of discussions over what I hesitate to even call a peace plan now in Ukraine?

There's a very tentative and cautious effort to push back against what the U.S. is hoping Ukraine will accept in terms of a deal with Russia. But what we're seeing is the Europeans are not yet being quite as forceful as they might be. So while the Europeans have certainly said we want to stand with Ukraine, we don't want the U.S. to force it into concessions, their narrative and their rhetoric is still very much, we respect the Trump administration, we think they're going to do the right thing. I'm very curious to see when that will change and when we see a tougher line from the Europeans. I know there's a lot of doubt about whether that might ever happen, but I think we're seeing this in the context of increased fears of a broader Russian effort in Europe. So beyond Ukraine and the sense of what happens if we do emboldened Vladimir Putin, give him significant land and make him think that this was a win here in Ukraine, three, four, five years online. are the Baltic states at risk. We've seen greater reports of Russian drones, intelligence plots, all of that, broader even as far as Ireland. So I think European leaders, while they're trying to be really cautious with the Trump administration, will probably push a harder line for Ukraine and not allow it to make these concessions. Jack Tetch, what about Volodymyr Zelensky, the president of Ukraine? He largely basically rejected that 20-point plan, which... originated in Russia or in Washington or a combination of both. It's come up with a revised draft of his own asks for any peace talks to move forward. What do we know about the Ukrainian perspective here and how much purchase it has in Europe and with the Americans? Yeah, that's right. Volodymyr Zelensky has unveiled a new 19-point plan for a demilitarized free economic zone in the Donbos. What that would look like is potentially American business interests operating in that area. So that's... clearly a move to placate Donald Trump, who that's one of his favorite talking points, but it would move away, of course, from Russian troops controlling that region, which is circulated in Russian proposals and, of course, in the American proposals. So, um, It seems like this has always been the key for Volodymyr Zelensky, right? We haven't resolved the security guarantees. We haven't resolved the territorial issues. Volodymyr Zelensky ran on keeping Ukraine whole six years ago in 2019. So if you were to cave on that now, that would be a huge public defeat for him. Well, President Trump sat down with Dasha Burns of Politico on Monday for an interview. The president again brought up the need for Volodymyr Zelensky to run an election in his country currently at war. Is it time for Ukraine to hold an election, do you think? Yeah, I think so. It's been a long time. It hasn't been doing particularly well. Yeah, I think it's time. I think it's an important time to hold an election. They're using war not to hold an election. But I would think the Ukrainian people would. You know, should have that choice. And maybe Volodymyr Zelensky would win. I don't know who would win, but they haven't had an election in a long time. You know, they talk about a democracy, but it gets to a point where it's not a democracy anymore. Well, hours after Politico released that interview, Volodymyr Zelensky said he would ask Parliament to draft a bill to hold elections within three months if the United States and European allies provided security guarantees for that election. Joyce, what else is contributing to this?

question coming up now at this point while these discussions are going on with Vladimir Putin about whether Volodymyr Zelensky should hold elections. So this was originally a Russian ask. Ah. That Volodymyr Zelensky is not popular. Why doesn't he hold elections? Then it became also a U.S. ask. Very much like the peace plan you're talking about. It was a Russian plan. Then it became a U.S. plan. Volodymyr Zelensky is desperate. He can't, he can't give up on the U.S. support. So whatever... Donald Trump needs, he sort of has to concede. But holding election in wartime is very challenging. I mean, you have million troops fighting. What are they going to do? Are they going to leave their bases and vote? You have Russia attacking Kiev day in, day out. How are people going to go under drones to vote the displaced, the occupied territories in Ukraine now, in the Donbass? How are these people going to vote? And who guarantees the safety and transparency? I mean, elections are good when they're free and fair. We believe in them. But what does it mean for Volodymyr Zelensky to be responding to what you said was primarily a Vladimir Putin leverage point? A Vladimir Putin asked. It's almost Vladimir Putin trolling. Why doesn't he have an election? He has no choice. If it's now a U.S. ask, he has to, you know, respond. And he dodged it to the parliament that we could discuss. We could hold an election. But having that impractical is nearly, I mean, it's very difficult. You don't see, I mean, the U.S. asking Gazans to hold elections. So Vladimir Putin can get Volodymyr Zelensky to respond to his demands by filtering them through the United States, it sounds like. And we've learned that through the Wall Street journal articles on Woodcoff, on the Bloomberg transcript of Woodcoff called with a Russian advisor to Vladimir Putin. I mean, it's very much circling these talking points that then come to the president, and he said it in the political interview. All right, well, let's step back from some of the day-to-day news from the week and reflect a little bit on the Trump administration's. I'll call it a new world order after nearly a year of the president's second term. There's a new national security and diplomacy doctrine out. We talked about it last week here on the show. One of the biggest shifts is in relations between the United States and Europe. The president sat down with Dasha Burns of Politico, as we mentioned. Here's a little bit more of that conversation. There'll be a point, and it's very close to that point. And what will that mean? It will mean that they're no longer going to be strong nations. Does that mean they won't be allies anymore? Well, it depends. It depends. They'll change their ideology, obviously, because the people coming in have a totally different ideology. It's going to make them much weaker. They'll be much weaker and they'll be much different. And what will that mean for our relationship with that? Look at your mayor of London. He's a disaster. He's a disaster. He's got a totally different ideology of what he's supposed to have. You know, sir, it's sometimes hard to tell when you say these things. Do you intend to send kind of a message of tough love to our allies to push them to make reforms? Or do you think that many of them are just weak and you don't really want to be allies with them? I think they're weak.

Now on Thursday, Ursula von der Leyen, president of the European Commission, responded. It's the voters who decide who is the leaders and nobody else is supposed to interfere without any question. I want to put this to the group. You've all covered U.S. diplomacy, defense, national security, foreign policy. You've been around the block, as they say. Akbar Shahid Ahmed, what do you make of these comments from the president? I think we have to call it what it is, which is so clearly advancing a nativist and one might come as close to saying racist narrative about Europe, right? You're seeing him call out leaders of... non-white heritage like the mayor of London. You're seeing him particularly talk about demographic change as being incompatible, essentially with a US-Europe alliance, which not only affects how he's seeing Europe, but suggests something about how he sees America, a country that itself is becoming majority non-white. I think you're going to see the Trump administration pressured Europeans much more, but it's quite ironic that given... its entire narrative throughout its time in office that European leaders have been suppressing their own populations. There now seems to be a very clear Trump agenda to advance a certain ideological bent on the continent. So this is part of why, while he's called himself a president of peace, while some of his supporters have said he's anti-intervention, he doesn't want to meddle in foreign nations or do nation building. That's precisely what we've seen the Trump administration to in the Middle East, in Latin America, and now in Europe, where there's crucial elections next year. Jack Dech, your reaction from your... Perch of many years covering these issues, not only to the president's Politico interview, which we heard where he called the European allies fundamentally weak, but to the diplomatic and defense posture, a national security posture document that came out that we've been discussing and the Trump administration's vision of America's role in the world order. Well, it's a revisionist view of the world order. It's a vision that sees. countries like Russia and China as ascendant. And it seems like especially the draft version that was leaked to Defense 1, which saw sort of a C5 replacing the G7 and bringing Russia and China into that fold. C5. What does that mean? The C5 would be sort of a core block of nations. It would include the United States, Japan, China, Russia. So you're talking about... a lot of the largest economic nations in the world, but I mean, it would be sort of revisionist view of the world where the U.S. is no longer necessarily an adversary with these countries, especially Russia and China, but they're sort of looking at them as security guarantors in their regions. Joyce, what's your view on Holmes? You know, very much what Jack is saying, but also, you know, this is a president who believes in profit first.

You know, making deals. So you see the Navidia deal with China, that's not national security first. That's really sending China AI chips that. They couldn't have before. When you look at the deals he's doing with the Saudis, with the Emirates, with the Qataris, it's all profit first. Add to that, the geopolitical realignment that he believes in. He called in the same interview with Politico, you know, Europe as an old country in decay. They don't know how to get their economy together. So this is very much in line with that realignment that the administration is seeking. I want to get everyone's quick reaction to just. One more story. One more thought. Everybody has heard Donald Trump's claim through repetition, through branding, that he's solved eight wars. then he's a president of peace. Now, two of the eight peace agreements in question that Trump takes credit for are under severe strain. Thailand and Cambodia are back at it this week. Violent clashes across their border. Also renewed fighting between the Democratic Republic of Congo and Rwanda backed M23 militia. Just for one thought, each of you, Akbar, you go first. I'm not so concerned about the president's self-branding, but about his ability to broker these deals and how he sells them to the public. It gets to what Jack was referencing, where this great power vision of instituting peace from above and just getting leaders to shake hands with Trump and say that they're going to support American businesses doesn't bring societies closer to accountability, justice, real questions of reconciliation. And I think that's the bigger lesson that hopefully the Trump administration will take into 2026 of if it wants to continue diplomacy. It's not just about having a few individuals around Donald Trump. Joyce. I mean, there is this confusion, it seems, in the administration, that a ceasefire is somehow a peace deal. It's not. It needs hard work. It's temporary. Twice in Gaza now, phase one gets implemented and phase two is fallen apart. So it's not surprising because when you look also at the State Department, they don't have the staffing to do this. Check. Yeah, it's kind of a move fast and break things approach to settling conflicts. The problem is the speed limit on all of this is Trump's attention span. And even as a mostly foreign policy president, you can't span yourself across this breadth of conflicts. It's too difficult. I want to thank all of you for your expertise this hour, Akbar Shahi Ahmed of HuffPost, Joyce Karim, of all monitor and Jack Dech of Politico. We want to leave you, though, with this story, a golden story.

From Argentina. That's an influencer and dog lover Fausto Du Perre. He led a record-breaking gathering. Of golden retrievers in Buenos Aires this week, I told you this was something you could feel good about. In the summer sun, 2,397 dogs barked, in concert, played, slobbered in Basque de Palermo. But the AP says, no group photo for all them dogs, despite Golden's wearing football jerseys, bows. Baseball hats, two-toes. No one wanted to lose their pup in the crowd. The Argentines beat the Canadians last year's unofficial record with a gathering in in Vancouver of... A small number of 1,685 golden retrievers on the West Coast of Canada. You can beat that. The Argentinians just did. Akbar, Joyce, Jack, thank you so much for being with us. Mike Kidd is our sound designer and engineer. Chris Castano is our digital editor. Maya Garg is our senior managing producer. Alexandra Bouti is our senior supervising producer. Eileen Humphreys is the editor and producer of 1A on demand. And Barbongiano produces our podcast. Special thanks to Matthew Simonson for additional podcast and on-demand support this week. This program comes to you from WAMU, part of American University in Washington, distributed by NPR. I'm Todd's Willick. Let's talk more soon. This is 1A.

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