Meet the Press NOW — November 5

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Welcome to meet the press now. I'm Kristen Welker in Washington, and we begin with the next moves for both parties after Democrats sweeping victories in elections all across the country. Voters saying the economy and cost of living are top of mind while rebuking the Trump administration. Right now, Democrats and Republicans are reckoning with the results, all while the government shutdown has now become the longest in history. Today, while hosting Senate Republicans at the White House, President Trump reacted to last night's results and offered his assessment about why Republicans had a tough night. Last night, it was not expected to be a victory. It was very Democrat areas. I don't think it was good for Republicans. I don't think it was good. I'm not sure it was good for anybody. But we had an interesting evening, and we learned a lot. If you read the pulses, the shutdown was a big factor, negative for the Republicans. And that was a big factor. And they say that I wasn't on the ballot was the biggest factor. Senate Majority Leader John Thune and House Speaker Mike Johnson, meanwhile, tried to downplay the results and concerns over the party's ability to maintain President Trump's coalition when, as he said, his name is not on the ballot. I think it's hard to draw conclusions. I mean, obviously, you know, we had states, you know, where we lost statewide elections yesterday, but I don't think anybody expected. in most cases that we were going to win those. I think the challenge for us going forward is make sure we're speaking to the issues the American people care about. I don't think the loss last night was any reflection about Republicans at all. The president is on the ballot in 2026. The President Trump is on the ballot next fall. Because if we lose the majority, if the Republicans, the common sense people here who are doing the job for the American people, if we lose the majority in the House and this radical element of the Democrat Party were able to take over. We've already seen that movie. They will try to end the Trump administration. Democrats like House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries, meanwhile, proclaiming last night's results show that, quote, the Democratic Party is back. In Virginia, New Jersey, and New York, the message of affordability propelled Democrats to victory with Abigail Spanberger, Mikie Sherrill, and Zohran Mamdani, all winning their respective races with the economy top of mind for voters. President Trump today touting his own record while speaking to business leaders in Miami. Almost 2 million American-born workers are employed today more than when I took office. That's nine months ago. Can you imagine? And I tell Republicans, if you want to win elections, you've got to talk about these facts. It's really easier to win elections when you talk about the facts.

Meanwhile, last night's results are fueling a renewed sense of excitement and optimism for Democrats heading into next fall's midterms. It's also sparked a contentious debate within the party about which playbook to follow can mayor elect Zohran Mamdani's success as an unapologetic, self-proclaimed democratic socialist be replicated in other campaigns? Or does the party follow the more establishment-backed moderate message of Abigail Spanberger and Cheryl? On top of all of it last week. night in California voters overwhelmingly supported Proposition 50. That's the redistricting ballot measure that could dramatically reshape the 2026 landscape. Joining me now is our team of reporters, NBC News chief data analyst, Steve Kornacki, is at the big board, of course. Also with me is NBC News Senior White House correspondent Gabe Gutierrez and NBC News correspondent Sam Brock. Thanks to all of you for being here after what was a late night for all of us. Steve, you and I were breaking down the results late into the night. Let's start in New Jersey, that big win by Mikie Sherrill. She was not expected to necessarily win by such a large margin. What are the implications and what does it say about the coalition that President Trump was able to put together in 2024 in that state? Yeah, I think, look, New Jersey offered a clue to a question that we have been asking nationally since the 2024 presidential election, and that is the non-white gains that Donald Trump made in 24. They were significant, especially among Hispanic voters. Were they going to be gains that the Republican Party itself kept that candidates not named Trump would be able to make as well when they ran? New Jersey's a great test case because Trump had really performed well, historically speaking for a Republican last year, because of... of non-white support. So the best single county to test this in perhaps right here, Hudson County, cross the Hudson River from New York City. You have a bunch of mid-sized cities here that are 75, 80% Hispanic. And you can see Mikie Sherrill won here by 50 points. I just want to roll back the clock a couple elections so you could see the story here. Last year, Donald Trump got within, it was 28 points. I mean, that's a lot, you know, that's a lot on paper. But of course, for a Republican, that's a great showing in Hudson County. So it was 28 last year. It's up to 50 now. And that 50 point margin, really, look, that's closer to being in line with what Democrats have been expecting out of Hudson County. So it really makes, when you put these elections together, it really makes that 2024. Trump performance here look like the outlier, look like the aberration. Republicans Jack Ciattarelli, they put a lot of effort into Hudson County with the idea of trying to get some of these Trump gains, and they got none of them.

Well, we were looking at Hudson, Passaic, so fascinating as those results came in. Stephen, of course, that was arguably Republicans' best chance last night for a pickup. Let's turn to Virginia and New York City. Those races, of course... viewed very closely in the question, were they a referendum on President Trump? New York has such a unique electorate. It's hard to make sweeping conclusions, and yet there were some clues there, Steve. Yeah, well, I mean, on the Trump question, too, I think most directly in Virginia as well. You see, again, like you said, it was expected that Abigail Spanberger would win this race. She won it by 15 points, maybe a little bit more than some folks were thinking. But Donald Trump's approval rating in Virginia in the exit poll sat at 39%. And Winston Merle Sears does a few points better than that. But look, I think the Trump approval was low in New Jersey. It was low in Virginia. It was low in California. The Republicans. Republican side of that initiative. We're all losing convincingly there. One other element in Virginia, I think, is worth considering is right up here, these blue counties, right outside Washington, D.C., northern Virginia, talking about federal employees, you know, the federal government, a big part of the economy here. The shutdown effect, was there one? I mean, look at Loudoun County. Almost a 30-point win for Abigail Spanberger here. This is a Democratic county, but it was only 16 points last year. Basically, Abigail Spanberger doubled that margin. So it might have been a shot. shutdown effect that are redounded to Democrats' advantage in Virginia. And then you talk about New York City as well. We'll just call that one up. We've got to make our way up here. There it is. New York City, the Big Apple, a nine-point win from Zohran Mamdani here. I do think one thing that was interesting was there was more of a coalescing of the non-Zohran Mamdani vote around Andrew Cuomo. than the polls had suggested Curtis Sliwa had been running at 15, 20 percent. He ends up with seven. Clearly, that vote that he lost went into Andrew Cuomo's column. Zohran Mamdani is over 50 percent right now, but just barely over 50 percent. And I think when you think about this, Kristen, overwhelmingly Democratic City. This is the Democratic nominee for mayor. Andrew Cuomo's personal negative ratings are astronomical. And Zohran Mamdani is going to get 50.4. percent, something like that. There's a lot of opposition to him. He enters the mayoralty, really with a divided city, I would say. That certainly is. And Steve, real quick on California, obviously we were watching Prop 50. Poll showed it was projected to pass. And boy, it sure did by a big margin. Yeah, basically almost two to one out there and quick, the effect of this right now, Republicans, the way the maps are, they can afford to lose no more than two seats in the House next year. When they redrew Texas earlier this year, if they got everything they wanted out of that, they would gain an additional five out of Texas. Suddenly, they'd have more of a pad for the House next year. But this map, if it does what Democrats think it will do, would give Democrats.

an additional five out of California would basically cancel out Texas. There are a bunch of other states now where this either is in motion or might be in motion. It may end up when you go through Republicans net a few more seats than Democrats, but Democrats did make a significant dent in what Republicans had done in Texas over the summer by passing that referendum yesterday. All right, Steve, breaking down all of the results for us. We'll get a little rest because the midterms effectively start today. Steve Kornacki, thank you so much for that. We appreciate it. Gabe, let me turn to you now. Let's talk about how Trump world officials are reacting to last night's dramatic election results. There's an attempt within the Republican Party to downplay them saying, look, these are traditionally blue states, blue cities, but... President Trump was quite clear. This is not a good sign. Yeah, that's exactly right, Kristen. And look, this is a rare course correction and a rare dose of humility from President Trump. Kristen, you played that soundbite in your introduction. When can you remember the last time that the president looked at an election result and came out and said, well, we learned a lot. That's not something you normally hear from the president. And we heard from him during his speech today to business leaders here in Miami. He used the word affordability several times. You've been hearing that from White House officials so far today, the vice president on social media, saying that Republicans need to do a better job of getting their message out and that they need to talk about affordability and the cost of living. Certainly, that was a main message from Mayor-elect Zohran Mamdani in his campaign. And while the White House has been slamming him, the press secretary, amplifying a message that the president said today, saying that they don't want, that New York went for communism over common sense. But at the same time, Kristen, while they have been slamming the messenger, they seem to have acknowledged that the message is resonating, and they do seem to try and course correct that before the midterms. The senior administration official tells me that while the president and the White House believes that he campaigned on affordability, and they do. believe some prices have come down. There's an acknowledgement that he does feel he needs to let voters know about this and feel this. And so expect the president to talk more about that going forward, Krista. And Gabe, it's notable because President Trump, almost doing his own analysis, said he attributes some of those losses to the fact that he wasn't on the ballot. What are sources saying about that? Right. Well, look, I think the president is, you know, blame shifting a bit or at least shrugging off some of the blame here, saying that he was not on the ballot and they're trying to downplay the sweeping nature of this, as you discuss, trying to paint this as, oh, this is just certain blue areas of the country. But as you mentioned, Speaker Mike Johnson saying that in next year's midterms in 2026 that President Trump and his policies essentially will be on the ballot, of course, that is higher stakes. That isn't just several areas across the country that the balance of the power in Congress hinges on.

that. But for this point, yes, the president, in a way, seems to be scolding Republicans that they didn't get the message out there. If he was on the ballot, he thinks, of course, they would have done better. But it's indicative of the president, you know, wanting to keep his hands out of this and, you know, didn't endorse several of the GOP candidates in this election. And so not wanting to take all of the blame for this, but in a rare acknowledgement that maybe that Republicans could have done a little bit better job here with messaging, Kristen. certainly was incredibly notable to hear that candor from the president, Gabe Gutierrez, traveling with President Trump in Miami. Sam Brock, let me turn to you. You were up late with the Zohran Mamdani campaign. This is so fascinating because he is a Democratic socialist who laid out big policy proposals in his campaign. Now he's got to not only govern Sam, but also try to rally the Democratic Party and New York. around him. What's his strategy to do that? Sure. You know, Kristen, first of all, it was great to be up late with you last night. Let's get that out there front and center. But I would just add, depending upon who you talk to, right? So Zohran Mamdani is either this transformational, generational figure that is going to uplift the working class in a way that we haven't seen in a major city before, or he portends serious issues when it comes to crime and lots of wealthy New Yorkers. fleeing the city because of higher taxes. There's no like middle ground in this. People feel very strongly one way or the other, which is really what Steve was getting at a second ago, a divided New York. But let's also reflect upon the fact that Mr. Zohran Mamdani had more than a million votes. To put this in context, the last mayoral election in 2021, when Mayor Adams won, had 1.1 million votes total, Kristen. So Zohran Mamdani already basically exceeded or matched that. And the thing is, he's brought in all of these new people into the coalition. And that's when we have a conversation around exportability and whether or not this is going to work outside of New York City when people who say, those crazy New York Democrats, you know, six to one outnumbering registered Republicans, only in a city like New York could you have Democratic socialism? Look at the coalition of people that he's brought in. So under 30, as you highlight, they're almost 80%. Asian 62%, lots of college graduates and renters. But I would also add this point, too, he has regained traction within constituencies that Democrats lost in the last election cycle. I'm talking about Latino voters and black voters. Even in the primary, he lost the Bronx, which has heavy minority constituencies by 18 points to Andrew Cuomo. And he was up 11 points last night in the same borough. Right? You saw a pivot within five. five or six months. So the power to magnetize and to broaden the coalition should be scaring Republicans potentially, even as they talk tough today and say that his ascendancy to the mayoralty of New York City means they're going to be basically attaching him to all of their critiques to members of Congress who are running for Congress, I should say, in the midterm elections. It is going to be fascinating to see how this all plays out. Well, Sam, we've got late with you phenomenal job there last night as we watched the results come in. Really appreciate your great reporting. Coming up, it's the economy and it's the longest government shutdown in U.S. history. What last night's election results mean for the future of negotiations. Plus, the fate of President Trump's tariff agenda hangs in the balance as the Supreme Court hears a case that could have sweeping consequences for the economy and the president's use of executive authority. Stay with us. You're watching Meet the Press Now.

Say you've always wanted to have a backyard oasis. Here's the thing. If you get smart with your money, you can do things like that. With Empower, you can start making the most out of your money so you can go out and live a little. Isn't that why we work so hard to have some fun with our money? So use Empower and get good at money so you can be a little bad. Join their 20 million customers today at Empower.com. Not an Empower client paid or sponsored. Hey everyone, it's me, Morgan Stewart, and I have a new podcast called The Morgan Stewart Show. Join me each week as I talk about pop culture, fashion, my personal life, and just a warning, I'm going to be giving my opinion on everything. I'll also have some really fun guests to join in on the fun. The Morgan Stewart Show is out now. Listen and follow wherever you get your podcast or watch full video on YouTube. Ever notice how life's best stories don't happen in your living room? They happen on the open road, out on the water, or parked under the stars. At Progressive, they get that you want to focus on the experience, not worry about the what-ifs. That's why they offer quality insurance designed for your ride, whether that's a boat, RV, or motorcycle. Adventure with Confidence. Visit progressive.com and see how easy it is to protect your favorite way to getaway. Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and Affiliates. Not available in D.C. prices vary based on how you buy. Welcome back. As we mentioned, the government shutdown is now officially the longest ever in American history. And President Trump is in part blaming the shutdown for Republicans' poor performances in last night's elections. And today, the Senate's top Democrat, Chuck Schumer, says he agrees with President Trump. Trump admits. that Republicans, the Republican shutdown is hurting him and his party. The president is right. We warned the president of the consequences of ignoring Democrats, ignoring the American people, ignoring the health care crisis. We warned the president that ignoring Democrats and insisting on zero negotiations was a recipe for disaster and would come back to haunt him. Well, Republicans shouldn't ignore us anymore. for their own good and the country's good. But after last night's Democratic sweep, the big question remains, what is the offerant from the shutdown? While Democrats are demanding Republicans come to the table, the president is standing firm telling Republicans they have to bypass Democrats by eliminating the filibuster or the 60-vote threshold. It's time for Republicans to do what they have to do, and that's terminate the filibuster. It's the only way you can do it. And if you don't terminate the filibuster, you'll be in bad shape. I think it's very important. We have to get the country open, and the way we're going to do it this afternoon is to terminate the filibuster. And it's possible you're not going to do that. And I'm going to go by your wishes. You're very smart people. We're good friends. But I think it's a tremendous mistake, really. It would be a tragic mistake, actually. Today, Republican Senate Majority Leader John Thune giving his blunt assessment of the president's demand. I think the president's views on the filibuster, you know, have been long held. And everybody, it's not like that surprised anybody. I just know, I know where the math is on this issue in the Senate. And it's not, it's just not happening.

Joining me now is senior national political reporter Sahel Kapoor Sahel. Thanks so much for being here. So yesterday there seemed to be some optimism among senators that there could be a deal to end the shutdown potentially. As soon as this week I was hearing Friday, is that still the sentiment on the hill or has some momentum been lost? It is not still the sentiment on Capitol Hill, Kristen. I would say there's more pessimism today than there was yesterday about ending the shutdown anytime soon. And there were two specific things that happened yesterday that have halted that momentum. The first is not just that Democrats won, most of these elections were in blue states and Democrats were expected to win, but it was the degree of the thumping that voters delivered to Republicans that has really caught many people off guard, including Democrats who didn't quite expect to win up by this much. The second is, as you just pointed out, President Trump, himself freely admitting that the shutdown is helping Democrats politically, and it's one of the reasons they won across the country in all those races. By the way, not just in the blue states, but they gained seats in the legislative space in red states like Mississippi. So there's already been a push in recent days from Progressive saying Democrats cannot cave now empty-handed, or it would simply undercut their own base. How can even the moderate Democrats who wanted to, you know, who wanted to cut a deal and find an off-ramp now be able to walk away and say, it's time to reopen the government when they are pretty obviously winning this fight, even according to President Trump. That is probably the biggest reason that these talks among centrist are, let's say they've hit a snag today. Well, let's talk about this back and forth over the filibuster. President Trump was pretty firm in his demand, and John Thune effectively said the math is the math. It's just not going to happen. I've been talking to some sources who say, wait a minute, given the losses overnight, it is possible that some Republicans could start to feel more pressure to move their position on getting rid of the filibuster. What are you hearing, Sahel? A few things, Kristen. Firstly, John Thune is right about the math. He does not have 50 out of the 53 votes he would need. In fact, I can easily count to four very, very deeply dug in firm nose on the filibuster who I don't think are going to switch under any circumstances. That said, President Trump does have a way of moving votes around here. He is moving some Republicans who were previously in the no column as recently as last week to a maybe or potentially, yes, that includes senators like Tommy Tuberville, Jim Banks, Ron Johnson, who have all expressed some interest in New York. the filibuster or at least creating a carve-out in response to Trump's demands. The predicament here is that Trump wants to reopen the government. He recognizes this shutdown is bad in a whole host of ways and also damaging to his party politically. But he doesn't want to negotiate with Democrats and Republicans don't want to nuke the filibuster, which means they either negotiate with Democrats or count on them to cave. Caving is less likely after yesterday. So this is a multi-dimensional paradox they're in. Meanwhile, lines getting longer outside food banks, delays piling up at airport. Sahel, thank you so much. We really appreciate it. Joining me now here in studio is Virginia, Congresswoman Jennifer McClellan. Congresswoman McClellan, thank you so much for being here. Thank you. I know it was a late night for you as well, so we appreciate your coming in. Let's start right there with the government shutdown. Do you have a sense that the government could reopen by the end of the week? What are the vibes that you're getting? I think the only way the government is going to reopen.

open is if Republicans come to the table and talk to Democrats. And in the House, you know, Speaker Johnson has shown no interest in doing that. At least there are talks on the Senate side. But in the House, we haven't been in session voting, in committee hearings, anything, since September 19th. So from day one, Democrats have been ready to negotiate a bipartisan budget, not just for a few weeks, but for, you know, the entire appropriations period. And Republicans don't see them interested. What do you? say to the argument that Democrats had a series of big victories overnight? You've proven your point. Now it's time to reopen the government and then negotiate over health care subsidies, which expire at the end of the year. I think anybody with that message isn't listening to the voters. What the voters said yesterday is we repudiate the policies of Donald Trump and the congressional Republicans. We are worried about the economy, which Donald Trump got elected, saying he was going to lower costs. He's done everything. but he's raised costs. We heard voters say we're worried about health care. We're worried about when we see open enrollment and our premium spike. We're worried about these Medicaid cuts. We're worried about our hospitals closing. We're worried about federal workers who have been fired. That was the message of last night's election, is they want leaders who are focused on their problems, putting people over politics. Fair enough. And yet federal workers are caught in the middle of this battle. In fact, Virginia has more federal workers impacted than almost any. other state, which you know all too well. People are suffering. Again, they're having to go to food banks just to feed their families. They're afraid about the food assistance programs that they may rely on. Is it time for both sides to come together and come off of? their sticking points and say, okay, we're going to figure out a way to reopen the government. Democrats have been ready to talk and negotiate from day one of this administration, from day one of the 119th Congress. And Republicans have made clear, we don't want to talk to you. Now, I've talked to federal workers, including one that I had on a town hall meeting, several of them at the polling places, and they have said, Thank you for fighting for us. They are upset at the way they were treated before the shutdown happened when 200,000 of them were fired. Some with less than 15 minutes of notice, they feel like they are being. villainized and that they are being thrown away and they're upset about it. And a lot of them came out and voted against Republicans yesterday and said they specifically came out because of what's happening in Washington. Let me ask you about the election results last night, Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries, saying that the Democratic Party is back. That's a direct quote. Do you agree with that assessment or do you think that's overstated? Does the Democratic Party still have a lot of work to do before it's viable again in the midter? I think the Democratic Party is viable in the midterms if we stick to a winning formula of meeting voters where they are, talking to them about the issues that matter to them, addressing the concerns that they raise, and meeting them everywhere where they are and leaving no corner of the Commonwealth of the country behind and talking to everyone, not just our base. I do want to ask you about the race for Attorney General, Jay Jones, one, despite the fact that his...

10 years in response to the census. But the Republicans began this game. If they want to continue down this road, I don't think Democrats should sit on the sidelines and just watch it happen, especially if the voters want us to respond. All right, Congressman McClellan, thank you so much for being here. Thanks for your perspective. Thank you. Really appreciate it. Coming up next, will the Supreme Court strike down the president's tariffs? We'll have the takeaways from today's oral arguments in a major tariff case that could append the president's economic agenda. You're watching Meet the Press Now. I'm from the Vatican Live tonight. Say you've always wanted to have a backyard oasis. Here's the thing. If you get smart with your money, you can do things like that. With Empower, you can start making the most out of your money so you can go out and live a little. Isn't that why we work so hard to have some fun with our money? So use Empower and get good at money so you can be a little bad. Join their 20 million customers today at Empower.com. Not an Empower client paid or sponsored. Hey, weirdos, I'm Elena. And I'm Ash, and we are the host of Morbid Podcast. Each week we dive into the dark and fascinating world of true crime, spooky history, and the unexplained. From infamous killers and unsolved mysteries to haunted places and strange legends, we cover it all with research, empathy, humor, and a few creative expletives. It's smart, it's spooky, and it's just the right amount of weird. Two new episodes drop every week, and there's even a bonus once a Find us wherever you listen to podcasts. Yay! Woo!

Summer means firing up the grill, getting together with friends, and making the most of the weekends. Total Wine and More is my first stop, whether it's Celsius and ready to serve cocktails with a cooler or a good bottle of bourbon. Everything I need is at Total Wine. With the lowest prices, it's easy to stock up for whatever the weekend brings, and I can get everything I need in one stop. Shop Total Wine and More and get ready for your next summer party. Spirits are not sold in Virginia or North Carolina. Drink responsibly must be 21. Welcome back. We are following breaking news where the fate of the president's sweeping tariff agenda is now in the hands of the Supreme Court. Justice is hearing arguments today on a case challenging the president's The International Emergency Economic Powers Act to impose many of those sweeping tariffs. The court's three liberal justices press Solicitor General John Sauer on whether the president's tariffs are infringing on Congress's authority to impose tariffs. And some of the courts' conservative justices expressed skepticism as well, including Justice Neil Gorsuch, a Trump appointee, who challenged the administration over its sweeping view of executive authority. how you'd because you say we shouldn't be concerned because this is foreign affairs and the president has an inherent authority and so delegation off the books more or less. And if that's true, what would prohibit Congress from just abdicating all responsibility to regulate foreign commerce, for that matter, declare war to the president? We don't contend that he could do that. What's the reason to accept the notion that Congress can hand off the power to declare war to the president? Well, we don't content that again. Well, you do. You say it's unreviewable. There's no manageable standard, nothing to be done. And now you're, I think you, tell me if I'm wrong. You backed off that position. Maybe that's fair to say. Okay, all right. That would really be an abdication, not a delegation. NBC News, senior Supreme Court reporter Lawrence Hurley joins me now, along with Timothy Bright Bill, an attorney specializing in international trade law and policy. Thanks to both of you for being here. Lawrence, let me start with you. So what an exchange there. You heard the folks in court actually start to laugh. It's not something you typically hear at the Supreme Court. What were your takeaways from what you heard today at the high court? Do the justices seem to be skeptical of the government's argument here? Yeah, I mean, there was definitely a sign that both liberal and conservative justices were pushing back on the solicitorial arguments that you had. And, you know, this is a court with a 6-3 conservative majority that is often backed President Trump in other cases that have come up recently. But this one is a slightly different case. It's a much closer call. And I think, you know, it's early to sort of say how it's going to come out, you know, wait to see what the ruling says. But I think, you know, it's an uphill battle for the administration.

Timothy, do you agree with that assessment? Do you see it as an uphill battle for the administration? And what do you make of how the plaintiffs argued their case today in court? I think you're correct. This is still a very close decision. The court's three Democratic justices will probably vote against President Trump's tariffs. And then the question is whether some of the other members of the court also have concerns about the president's use of this law. And the argument focused quite heavily on the law used by President Trump, IEPA, and whether that law, which gives the power... to the president to regulate imports also includes the power to impose tariffs. That dominated most of the hearing. And I'll say the justices asked very difficult questions of both sides. Lawrence, I want to play another exchange, this one with Chief Justice John Roberts. Get your reaction on the other side. Take a look. I mean, it's been suggested that the tariffs are responsible for significant reduction in our deficit. I would say that's raising revenue domestic. There certainly is an incidental and collateral effect of the tariffs that they do raise revenue, but it's very important that they are regulatory tariffs, not revenue-raising tariffs. Lawrence, was there any surprise that the conservative justices seemed to question the government's argument in such a searing way? Not particularly. I mean, this is a case where it doesn't really cut across your typical ideological lines like we've seen in some of these other contentious issues that have come up towards the court, right? There are plenty of conservatives, including conservative lawyers, conservative judges, who think that on tariffs in particular, it's both bad policy. to have the tariffs, but also he doesn't have the authority to actually do it. And so this is an area where some of the conservative justice may be in sync with that thinking, and also based on sort of conservative legal thinking that predates this particular case. So I could see some of them, you know, at least some of them wanting to side with the liberal justices on this one. Yeah. Timothy. Is there a plan B in case the Supreme Court does strike down the president's tariffs? He said that this is the most important court case to go before the Supreme Court in U.S. history. Yes, this is certainly the biggest trade case the Supreme Court has ever heard. And to answer your question, I'm sure the Trump administration does have a plan B. Tariffs are going to be a cornerstone of this administration's economic policy. And so if the court finds that the president's use of this law was improper, there are other tools in the toolbox, other laws that the president could use. Now, those laws take more time.

They require investigations by the Commerce Department or the International Trade Commission or other bodies. And so it is different from using this law to impose fentanyl tariffs on China, Canada, and Mexico and these broad reciprocal tariffs on almost all countries. What's the broader implications for the U.S. economy, Timothy? Well, I think that we're still learning the implications. I mean, this president is very focused on the stock markets and very focused on the economy as a whole. I think we haven't seen the full impact of the hundreds of billions of dollars of tariffs that have been collected yet. It may be possible to do this without harming the economy. I think the day is still. But the real legal question here is, did President Trump use the right tool? And did Congress delegate this power to the president? Right now, Timothy? I think importers are waiting to see what happens. If there is a decision.

process. Right now, companies should just be planning on some form of tariffs, whether it's these or others. I mean, this administration is going to move forward. And so I think it's best for companies and industries to be prepared for that. And Lawrence, just finally, what's the timeline that you're looking at here? When do you think the Supreme Court could make a final decision? Yeah, so typically, you know, the court takes quite a long time to issue written rulings, but this case is being heard on an expedited basis. And we've seen in other cases fairly recently that they can turn things around pretty quickly when they want to, especially if they already, which, you know, is not clear in this case. But I think it's quite possible we could get a ruling before the end of this year or early next year. All right. Lawrence, Timothy, really appreciate your insights into what happened today at the Supreme Court. Great to see both of you. Coming up after the break, decision 2026, the fight for control of Congress is officially on as both parties grapple with last night's results and what it all means for their midterm strategies in the run up to next November. Stay with us on meet.

We've got some breaking news tied to the ongoing government shutdown to tell you about now moments ago. The FAA announcing that they are planning on air traffic by 10% across 40 high-volume markets saying they need to maintain safety during the government shutdown if the government isn't open by Friday. The FAA also saying that they will release a list of the airports that will be impacted tomorrow. A dramatic development joining me now to discuss it. Our panel, Lisa Desjardin, correspondent for PBS NewsHour, Democratic strategist Joel Payne and Republican strategist Matt Gorman. Thanks to all of you for being here. I know everyone's a little bleary-eyed after staying up late last night and tracking election results. Lisa, I have to start with you. This is a big announcement by the FAA. It will undoubtedly add to the pressure on both sides of the aisle to come to the table and get the government reoc. And think about this. Think about the millions of Americans who are affected by people. traveling to or from them or traveling and they don't yet know, won't know until tomorrow morning if they are affected. Until this announcement came out and I'm waiting to hear from my sources, especially Democrats, what it means to them, the shutdown was moving farther away from resolution as opposed to yesterday when Senate Democrats seemed to be pushing for that. The election changed the dynamics. Some of President Trump's words changed the dynamics. Will this change it again? This just came out, so we're going to wait and see. Yeah, Matt, pick up on that point because one of the big pressure points is President Trump telling Republicans to get rid of the filibuster. John Thune says there's not enough votes to do that. But again, the president's applying this pressure against the backdrop of the FAA now saying, that they're going to essentially have to scale back their staffing. There's no pressure on members of Congress waiting in delays at airports, I'll tell you that. But you're right. I mean, look, they previewed this last night even before polls closed where there's an Axiose story saying that Trump's ready to turn up the pressure on Republicans. Now, look, I expected the White House when it seemed like we got it. It wasn't John Thune coming out in support of ending the filibuster or some backbench members. It was over folks like John Cornyn, folks who need an endorsement in a primary. So there was the Overton window shifting. And we talked about this a couple days ago. Republicans and the White House see a first mover advantage. If Democrats already came out and said, we're going to end this as soon as we get back into power, be the first mover here. And there's a big difference between doing it to start of Congress and doing it for a temporary CR on, you know, days notice. Yeah, absolutely. Joel, the theory goes that Democrats had a strong night. And by some accounts, some are arguing, why not say this was a win? To the negotiating table, let's reopen the government, and then discuss extending health care subsidies. Do you see any scenario where that happens? Oh, I'm sure there are always anxious Democrats who are always looking to find a reason a cave. That is a core characteristic of a Democrat on Capitol Hill. But of any realistic read of the policy. Say that, you know, I don't know if Democrats are winning, but Republicans are certainly losing. President Trump's taken on a lot of water. It's clear that the public at large thinks that President Trump, it's a failure of leadership, that he's allowed the government shutdown to get to this point. Republicans are taking on a lot of water. I don't think Democrats love the idea of the government being shut down, but I don't think Democrats feel any undue burden to go out of their way to bend over backwards to fix a problem Republicans created. Lisa, it was remarkable.

hear President Trump effectively say, yeah, we had a bad night last night, and we're going to talk about what to do about it. And there's a sense that there does need to be more of a focus on the economy, both in messaging and maybe in strategy as well. What are you hearing there? What do you think the impact will be? You've covered him so long. I, too, was amazed. This is someone who doesn't ever admit a loss whatsoever, especially on something that's major. So that was a significant... factor in, I think, Republicans thinking right now, they are doing their own sort of autopsy reports, and it is the word affordability. And that's not a word that Republicans have been saying. You've been here not out of New York City and the mayor elect. So the question is, what does that look like? And even out of Speaker Johnson's office, I can report. Some of them have been saying, this is the way to get around the ACA debate, is to talk about lower-in prices. Maybe it's not the ACA. Maybe it's a different way. The problem for Republicans is they don't have that plan yet. They have 500 pieces of different plans that haven't come together. They need a plan and they need it now, but they don't have it now. Kristen, can I have a second word to affordability, unpopular? Donald Trump is deeply unpopular. His agenda is unpopular. The Republicans that are holding him up are taking on water and unpopular. And this is a president that very soon Republicans will realize is a lame duck. And I think that's the elephant in the room that I think Republicans have yet to kind of confront at the moment. making that really important point. We're seeing that his popularity, particularly as it relates to the economy, Matt, in the 30s. And that was undoubtedly an anchor on some of these Republican candidates. You think about a state like New Jersey. Arguably the best shot Republicans had last night to win. And yet affordability, the fact that President Trump's approval ratings are hovering in the low 40s. How much of a weight do you think that was? It wasn't a surprise that Chigorei lost, but certainly by the margin he did. I think that was one of the big surprises of the night. And I think, you know, goes back to the filibuster. I'm sure folks in the White House are saying, look, the filibusters is a way we can probably get some things passed to put some points in the board here without having to worry about dem blockage. But I'll see this. You know, a hallmark of the first term, it was disorganized coming in the White House. You had the RNC folks coming in back in early 2017. There was factions, and it was a lot of disorganization. Second term was... almost the complete opposite. Uber organization, things ready to go on day one. But for the first time, almost a year in exactly since he was elected, you have a little bit of confidence rattling. You have a little bit of nerves rattled and some confidence needs to be short up for the first time. Joel, do Democrats run the risk of reading too much into last night's results? Because after all, we are talking about New Jersey, which is traditionally blue. Virginia, where history tells us that the opposing party usually wins the governor's seat in these off-year elections and then New York, which has its own unique electorate. It's always a good idea to temper excitement with some humility. I think those factors are right. I think these are states that Democrats should have performed well in, but the degree to which they performed well. I remember Matt and I were actually a couple months ago sitting on a conversation on a panel. We were talking about how in states like New Jersey and Virginia and other blue states, Donald Trump actually made gains in 2024. A lot of those gains disappeared last night.

Some of those southern New Jersey towns, some of those suburbs of New York City that Donald Trump made gains with Latino communities, with traditional democratic constituencies, all reversed. And I think you'd have to blame that on the fact that his agenda is unpopular. And I don't think the American people see him focused on affordability the way he talked about on the campaign trail last year. And Lisa, is there something to President Trump's argument? The ballot. And so those constituents that he was able to drive out just did not turn out or they voted for the Democrat last night. I think it hurt Republicans that he wasn't on the ballot and it helped Democrats that he's still president and that he was, in fact, we know it is a test of presidents, these elections when they're in office like this. As to the moving left. Looking at the data last night, there's 95 counties in the state of Virginia. 90 of them moved left. Some of the biggest ones moved left by 16 points over what Trump did. And on the filibuster, something that I want to make sure is said here. President Trump has been saying, oh, Democrats will change it when they get in office. No, Democrats don't have the votes to change the filibuster right now. They too would have to have a very serious family conversation. I'll make a plea to Donald Trump. Please change the filibuster. Democrats would love if Donald Trump did a dirty work there. Let's talk about Zohran Mamdani and Zohran Mamdani before we go. Joel, what do you make of his win? Again, New York, a unique electorate. He's running against Andrew Cuomo, who was facing a lot of headwinds in his own campaign. And yet he did have a message of affordability that resonated very different than the message that. that Governor-elect Abigail Spanberger or Mikey Sheryl ran on. What do Democrats make of these victories? Well, it's interesting. You know, that New Jersey and Virginia race, that to me was a commentary on Donald Trump. New York City was a commentary on the Democratic Party and the future of the Democratic coalition. Democrats need to be in the business of more. And that's what Zohran Mamdani represents to me. It's more. It's a broader coalition. It's a different way to think about working class versus wealthy. Remember, Zohran Mamdani started his campaign by talking to Trump voters in New York City. People who Democrats lost. to figure out why did you vote for Donald Trump? And I think him building his coalition around that, it's actually a really good guidepost for Democrats who are looking to kind of replicate his gains while not necessarily replicating his political bio, right? No, not everyone's going to be a former Democratic Socialist of America. Not everyone is going to have the skill set that he has. But there are ways to replicate that coalition. Matt, you know, President Trump has been very clear. He plans to wrap Zohran Mamdani around the entire Democratic Party. Zohran Mamdani came out swinging last night. How do you see this dynamic playing out? It plays well for both of them. I think his endorsement of Andrew Cuomo said less about Andrew Cuomo, but more about elevating Zohran Mamdani. I think they both see a foil in the other. They both benefit from elevating the other. This is a fight that's going to last next three years at least. All right. Ten seconds. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, still the one to watch out of New York City.

Right. There we will leave it. Thank you for a great conversation. Lisa Joel and Matt really appreciate it. Still to come, feeling the pinch, a live report from a South Carolina Food Bank that is under pressure to meet urgent new demands in a state where more than half a million people depend on SNAP benefits. Keep it right here on Meet the Press now. Welcome back. The ongoing government shutdown is putting increased pressure on food banks as millions of Americans are not getting the food assistance they need through SNAP benefits. You are looking at drone footage here of a very long line of cars waiting to access a food bank in South Carolina. Take a look at how long it stretches. Starting today, soldiers from the South Carolina State Guard are deploying to overwhelmed food banks to help with logistics and security. But despite that logistical help, food pantries say they still aren't getting the financial assistance they need. They're not funding it and they're expecting food banks to step up and bridge that gap. We're not made to be a replacement for a federal program. It's physically impossible. NBC news correspondent, Aaron, Gilchrist, joins me from South Carolina. Aaron, thanks so much for being with me. So there you are at the Food Bank. How much longer can it sustain its operations there? Well, the CEO of Harvest Hope here in Columbia, South Carolina, told me, Kristen, today that... This is not sustainable. They have seen a tremendous increase in demand in just this last week since the governor here in South Carolina said that the state would not be stepping in to help with funding these food banks that people are being told to go to. They've seen a 30 to 40% increase in demand for help from food banks in the last couple of weeks here, Kristen. And the folks who run the food banks say that they're going to do everything they can to keep up with that demand, but this is not something that is sustainable long term or even really for another. few weeks, more than another few weeks. Just very quickly, what are officials' biggest concerns right now? Well, it's money. Being able to generate enough money to keep buying food, to keep handing it out to folks who are in dire need at this point in time. The state stood up its one SC fund. It's a way for people to donate to the Community Foundation here in this area. I want you to hear from the CEO of that organization about what their needs are. The urgency is the biggest concern. Hunger is not something that you can live with if you are a two-year-old or if you are an 80-year-old. You can't sustain your life without food. This is the most basic need that we have. And so the urgency is there. I think that there are companies, foundations, and even donors who are waiting to see what's going to happen politically. This is not the time to wait.

They've received more than $240,000 in donations from hundreds of donors over the last week, Kristen. That is not enough. They need to fill the gap for a program that's $105 million, Kristen. The needs continue to grow. Aaron Gilchrist, thank you so much for that. We appreciate it. And we are back tomorrow with more Meet the Press now. There's more ahead on NBC News Now. Say you've always wanted to have a backyard oasis. Here's the thing. If you get smart with your money, you can do things like that. With Empower, you can start making the most out of your money so you can go out and live a little. Isn't that why we work so hard to have some fun with our money? So use Empower and get good at money so you can be a little bad. Join their 20 million customers today at Empower.com. Not an Empower client paid or sponsored.