Oregon lawmakers urge state corrections department to curtail use of solitary confinement

The Civics Education Initiative, a statewide program sponsored by the Oregon State Capital Foundation. They help Oregonians learn how our government and democracy work and how you can get involved and make a difference. Grant applications to help nonprofit and educational organizations support civics education programs throughout Oregon are open now through September 30th at Oregoncapitalfoundation.org. This fall, let Curiosity lead you to Newport. The Newport Festival of Arts and Culture brings together music, arts, markets, culinary experiences, and community celebrations on the Oregon Coast. From September through November, take in world-class performances, explore the historic Bayfront, and discover the stories that make Newport unique. Unlock exclusive lodging offers for OPB listeners at Discovernewport.com slash OPB. The Newport Festival of Arts and Culture? where creativity is in the water. This is Think Out Loud on OPB. I'm Jeff Norcross in for Dave Miller. On any given day, between 80,000 and 120,000 adults are held in solitary confinement in U.S. jails and prisons. That's according to the group's Solitary Watch. In Oregon, several prisoners have filed a class action lawsuit against the practice, saying it violates the state constitution's prohibition against, quote, harsh, degrading, or dehumanizing treatment of prisoners. Separately, a group of state lawmakers has formally requested that the Oregon Department of Corrections sharply curtail views of isolation as a form of discipline. Farah Chichi is one of those lawmakers. She's a Democratic state representative from the district serving Beaverton and Aloha, and she joins us now. Representative Chaiti, welcome to think out loud. Thanks for having me. Given that there is already a lawsuit about the practice, why take this action? Well, at the time, I didn't realize that there was a lawsuit coming. I've just really been a big advocate for criminal justice reform. I think this is one of the most cruel things that we do in prisons. And so after I went to a symposium in May, I really wanted to come after something that... is horrific. What did you learn at that symposium? Just the depths of the cruelty that happens to adults in custody, that's what we call people who are in prisons now. If I say AIC, that's adults in custody. Thank you. Just the way that we... treat AICs behind bars. They don't have a lot of agency or rights or whatever. And then on top of that, we're going to degrade them and cut them off from human contact and use that as a form of punishment when there's a broad... breadth of research that says this is harmful psychologically it creates negative outcomes for people there's just no reason to do it and it's literally torture like it's recognized as torture on the international stage what is your understanding of what solitary confinement in oregon actually is and and why it's a problem um being locked up for

22 hours a day in a cell that doesn't have access to any windows and you're not getting any meaningful human interaction. You're often cut off from your family. Like you can't communicate with them. You if you're going to disciplinary unit, you don't get hygiene products for 30 days, which seems needlessly cruel. I mean, it's all needlessly cruel, but that seems especially cruel. And you just lose all track of time. And what are the effects of this solitary confinement on people who experience it? For folks who already have mental health issues, it makes them decompensate even further. For folks who don't go in there with existing mental health issues, it creates... anxiety, depression, trauma. We see that they have worse outcomes for recidivism when they get out later because also you have to understand that 95% of people who go to prison in the country will come out. So they're coming back to us in community. And when we inflict this kind of psychological damage on people, they're coming back out here to their friends, family, and communities harmed. And it's going to make it harder for them to reintegrate. with the rest of their community. Do you have an example of someone in custody in Oregon who was put into solitary and had a really bad outcome? I don't know the names, but yes. And there are people who don't come out of solitary confinement because they've committed suicide. Okay. What specifically are you asking for from the DOC? We would like to... I personally would like to see solitary confinement completely abolished. But right now we're asking for no more than 15 consecutive days in solitary. And we want there to be meaningful human contact. You can have people separated out of the population, the general prison population for safety reasons. But that doesn't mean that you have to isolate them completely. They should still be able to call their friends and family. do the programming that they are a part of and have like human interactions. You have a term for what you're asking for. You're asking that the rules that the state of Oregon adopt align with what are known as the Mandela rules. What are those? Basically what we're talking about now. Meaningful human contact, no more than 15 days. Basically treating people with the human dignity and respect that they deserve that is inherent to all of us as human beings. Just because you are an AIC doesn't mean that you are less than a person. It's interesting. You did get a response from the Oregon Department of Corrections Director Mike Reese. He sent you and your fellow lawmakers a letter this week. And you mentioned... You mentioned meaningful contact, and in his letter, Director Reese says a standardized definition of the term meaningful human contact is being developed to ensure clarity and consistency across institutions. We currently engage AICs with special housing program coordinators, mental health sessions, health services education, and other evidence-based programs. The special housing unit team is also establishing procedures to accurately track meaningful human contact for data reporting purposes.

This will support compliance, program evaluation, and improvements in service delivery. How do you respond to that? I think that them working on defining this stuff, they're creating a foundation for what we're asking for. So I think that that's actually a pretty good step. Okay. When did you become aware of this problem in Oregon specifically? Well, I've been driven by criminal justice reform since high school when I joined Amnesty International, which I think was probably the first time I learned about what solitary confinement was. But in Oregon specifically, I've been hearing about it. Since I started in the legislature in 2023, because I'm a member of the Judiciary Committee, you have folks coming in and advocating about stuff, including former adults in custody, where they tell you about their experiences. And then in May, there was a symposium about solitary confinement specifically that the Oregon Justice Resource Center put on, I think with Unlock the Box, which is a national organization that's working on solitary confinement issues. And I got to hear stories of people who have actually been in solitary. solitary, especially one person who was clearly retaliated against for the work that he was doing as a jailhouse lawyer, Mark Wilson, he got to explain what happened. He got six months in solitary confinement after being found in possession of contraband, but that contraband was a toy telephone. If you're just tuning in, we're talking with Democratic State Representative Farah Chichi. She is part of a group of lawmakers who are calling on the Department of Corrections to sharply limit the use of solitary confinement. Representative Chichi, I want to refer back to that letter that Director Mike Reese sent you. He said, we recognize the broad body of research identifying the potential harms associated with prolonged solitary confinement, particularly for individuals with mental health needs and other vulnerabilities. However, the term prolonged solitary confinement has a specific legal definition that the DOC does not follow in practice. DOC does use special housing units to handle a variety of safety, security, behavioral, medical, or operational needs. All special housing procedures are guided by our desire to provide the least restrictive environment appropriate to maintain safety. These procedures are regularly reviewed to support an adult in custody's prompt, safe, and successful return to less restrictive housing. How do you respond to that? I think that there are a lot of different phrases that get used for different types of housing. It's kind of like... whack-a-mole, I guess. We don't call a solitary confinement. We have a disciplinary segregation unit, intensive management unit. So I need to parse what the actual terms mean in practice rather than what they are on a piece of paper, just because that's not what they do.

currently under the specific definitions and words that that we're saying doesn't mean that the impact isn't this what's happening, this isolation of people and punitive isolation of people. But you do have to have specifics and you do have to have. verifiable and concrete limits. And in fact, Director Reese mentions that the legal and international prolonged solitary confinement definition is the confinement of an incarcerated person to a cell for 22 to 24 hours a day with a lack of meaningful human contact for a duration exceeding 15 days. Is that your understanding of the definition too? And is that not good? Yes, but what does meaningful, like they're talking about defining meaningful contact, what does meaningful contact mean? Because for some people, the nurse that's passing out the meds is considered meaningful contact, but you're not actually engaging with a human on like a person-to-person level, which is part of that isolation problem that we're talking about. Do you think that there is any reason to remove an incarcerated person from the prison population, even for just a little while? You can definitely remove people from situations when they're emotionally dysregulated. We're not saying you can't do that, but we are saying that you can't keep them there for... weeks, months, I mean, I don't think we're doing it for years, but other jurisdictions are. You can't do that for a prolonged period of time specifically if it's in response to a disciplinary issue. Like if somebody is emotionally disregulated and they are physically safety risk to themselves or others, that's one thing. But putting people in disciplinary segregation because they were disrespectful or they were in like the wrong section that they're not allowed to be in. is a whole other issue. Okay, so you've made a request to the Department of Corrections and you have gotten a response. I'm assuming that you're not crazy about the response and you think it should be stronger. So what is next for you and your colleagues in the state legislature? Well, I appreciate that they are trying, but we want to do a bill, or at least my office, wants to do a bill anyway, because right now we're looking at rules, policies. of DOC by itself. They get to do that. But that can change based on whoever is in charge at the agency, in the governor's office. The legislature has a responsibility to set forward a positive vision about what we actually want to see happen. And so my office is going to bring a bill next session. Are you watching this lawsuit that the prisoners have brought against the DOC, too? Is that going to guide your actions as well? I'm watching it, but their react, the judicial branch is going to react to what things are right now. And.

I want us to move forward with a brighter path, not just a, this is the least that you have to do. And you're currently being in violation of this particular provision of the Constitution. They don't legislate. We legislate. So it'll be nice to hear what they have to say, but I think we should be doing our work independent of that. What gives you hope that the practice of solitary confinement in Oregon prisons will change in any kind of substantial way? Well, it's... indefensible this practice. Like you're not hearing from DOC in that letter. We like this and we want to continue doing it. I think that the inertia of these large agencies, like corrections in the United States for centuries at this point, makes people think that it can't change. We have a flag in my office that says better things are necessary and possible. And I feel like a lot of people forget that second half, but it is possible to change it, even if it's been this way. for a very long time. Okay. Why do you personally care about this? Why is it something that you've tried to kind of lead the parade on when it comes to reforming the way this practice happens at the state level? Because they think that we should be respecting the inherent dignity of every person no matter what. And... Folks have done some not great things, but that doesn't mean that we should treat them like they are inhuman. And we lose our own humanity treating people inhumanely. Farrow Chai Chi, thank you so much for the time. I appreciate it. Thank you. Farah Chichy is a Democratic representative from District 3, which covers Beaverton and Aloha. Think out loud, and all of OPB's reporting in our communities are made possible by the support of our members. Do your part to help make it happen. Become a sustaining member now at opb.org slash pod.