Power Pair: Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis celebrate a Minnesota homecoming

Programming supported by Topline Construction Firm, your local woman owned and operated roofing contractor, offering sustainable American-made steel roofing and siding with unmatched durability, roofing, deck, siding, and aluminum seamless gutters. More at Topline ConstructionFirm.com. That, my friends, is an example of the Minneapolis Sound. You're listening to The Time, and the name of that song is Get It Up. And two members of that band would later go on to become legendary award-winning music producers. That's right. My guest today are Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis. And I'm Angela Davis. This is NPR News, and I'm so glad you could join us today. Hello, Jimmy and Terry. Welcome home. Good time. be home. Nice to see you. You two are among the most successful songwriting and producing teams in music history. Your work has crossed genres and generations. We're still dancing the songs 40 years ago, a lot of us. You've had 42 number one hits on the Billboard charts. You've been inducted into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. But what I most love about you is that you are still very dear... friends. You have a close relationship as well as a business partnership that's lasted 50 years now. And so that's where I want to start with our interview today. I have a series on this program called PowerPairs. And so I regularly sit two people down together. And I ask them about how they make each other better. So what I want you to do is I want you to describe, you know, what you have meant to each other over the years and how you've been able to stay so closely connected. So, Jimmy, when you look at three years sunglasses, when you look at Terry, describe who you see sitting right there. Well, I see my best friend and I see the most unselfish person that I know. person that taught me a lot about being unselfish. I grew up, I had half brothers and sisters that were already grown and out of the house, so I kind of grew up as an only child. And I wasn't used to, I mean, I was just used to having everything my way, you know, to be honest. And I watched the way Terry moved and how generous he was with people and how giving he was. And it just was a great example. of how you're supposed to be. And so I use him as my role model for that. The other thing about Terry is that it's important to have people in your life that see you better than you see yourself. And I think Terry has done that for me. continuously, really throughout our careers, he's always been the one that said to me, no, you know, Jim, you can do that, you can do that, you should do that, you know, you should be doing that, you know, and you have, you know, so it's great to have people that are like that. So, but I just, I mean, mostly just unselfish. Terry, what do you see? Who do you see when you look at Jimmy? Well, it's a lot of things I see.

But Jimmy Jam, one of the most talented people I've ever known, period. And I always see that, like, that says a lot coming from an era where I spent, you know, many years around Prince, who was one of the most significant, talented people in the world, period. But Jimmy Jam is equally as talented, just different. You know what I mean? So he's so talented and creative that it's incredible. But he's also what I call Senator Jam. Senator Jam. Yes, he's Senator Jam. He's the ultimate diplomat. Something that I, sometimes I am not because I'm not really diplomatic that way. But, I mean, he's taught me how to be better at it because I grew up in a world in my mother's house. It was cut and dry. It was like no wiggle room. You know, you were accountable fully for all your actions. But often in business partnerships, there's often some creative differences. How do you guys work with that when you don't agree on things? And is it 50-50 or how do you describe this partnership or doing things together? It's certainly 50-50. It starts there. That's the foundation. It starts there. But any differences of opinion, we don't try to find the right way. We try to find the best way to achieve the result that we're looking for. I want to talk about the song I played in the open. It's one of my favorite songs by the time. But when I was researching and reading about it and tell me if this is true, I read and I was surprised to learn that when it was recorded, that is actually Prince performing on every instrument and singing the vocals. Is that right? Yes and no. He's, he's, yes, Prince is playing a lot of the instruments, but Morris Day is playing the drums and Morris Day is singing. But yes, that is true. I mean, that was totally masterminded by Prince. And when you think of him and your relationship with him, how do you describe how he inspired and influenced the work that you were able to do? Well, Prince, I always say the thing that I learned the most from Prince was work ethic. He would outwork everybody, and he'd do it by example. Like, he would come and rehearse us for six hours. He'd go and rehearse the revolution for six hours. And then he'd, you know, go make a record overnight and walk back in the next day with a cassette and he'd pop it in and it would be like 1999 or something. And he would say, I did this last night. And we'd be like, wow. You know, never saw him sleep. I don't know when he ever slept. But he was really the walking embodiment of music to me. So I think that was the thing I took away from him. And he made me able to do things. I was always a story I tell about 777931 on that song. We rehearsed it. And when we were done, Prince said, Jimmy Jam, what are he doing with your left hand? Because I was only playing with one hand. And I said, nothing, Prince. I'm just doing my part. He says,

do double Monty's part. It's got to be bigger, bigger and better than the record. Okay, cool. So we do that. Then he goes, what note are you singing on the chorus? And I said, I'm not singing on the course. You know, Terry and then Mark, find a note and sing on the course. Got to be bigger than the record. Okay, cool. So now I'm seven, seven, seven, 93, 11. Then he goes, Jimmy Jam, why aren't you doing the choreography? Like Prince, I'm standing behind a keyboard. He says, it's simple choreography. He should be able to do it. So now I'm trying to hit the choreography, play my notes, sing my, you know, my note. And I couldn't do it. I'm so frustrated. Next day we come back, first thing Prince says it's 777, and I'm like, oh, man. We started into the song. About halfway through the song, I realized not only am I playing my part, singing my part, and hitting the step, but now I've even found I can take my hanky out my pocket and I can pat my face, I can tip my hat. They helped you grow. Yes, because he saw things once again. Like a great coach, you know, just got the most out of the people that were there, you know, because he knew I could do it. And so it changed my way of thinking instead of what I couldn't do. It was about, oh, yeah, I can do that. That was a big deal. How do you think about how Prince influenced the work that you do in your career, Terry? Well, creatively, just watching how he was so fluid with it. He was so in the moment. And, you know, you would be in the studio with him, although he would make us clap for about five hours. Yeah. Yeah. And do claps. Yeah. But he was so fluid in the moment. He would just create something like out of nothing so quickly. And then when you have a creative setting, you have options. But he was so quick to choose the options. And so he used to always ask me, what would you do? And I'd tell him what I'd do. And he said, well, I wouldn't do that. I was like. Choice is Terry Lewis. That's what he always say to me. So, yeah, choice is Terry Lewis. So you two grew up in Minneapolis, but now live in the Los Angeles area. So let's talk about what has brought you home. It is a one-night-only concert during the Minnesota State Fair. Mark your calendar, Saturday, August 29th, at the grandstand. It's called Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis Homecoming, a celebration of the Minneapolis Sound. And I just want to read this long list of special. guests that have been announced, including Johnny Gill, Belle Bivdevo, Morris Day, and Jerome Benton of the Time, Jim Jordan Knight of New Kids on the Block, Stokely, Ann Nesby, and The Sounds of Blackness, Ruben Gallego Studdered, Janice Wilson, and gospel singer Yolanda Adams. I bought tickets as soon as this was announced, but what can we expect to see and hear that night, Jimmy? I think we're going to be there for a few hours, right? We're definitely going to be there for a few hours because lots of hits to play, lots of hits to play.

But really it is a celebration. We're calling it made in Minnesota. The whole idea is that all of the music that you hear around the world that has come from... this area come from made in Minnesota because all of those most of those acts are pretty much all of the acts that you named all recorded in Minnesota whether they were from here whether they traveled here from other parts of the world I mean obviously people like the human league came from you know London to come you know from England to come here and record so we're going to hear some human league in a few minutes yeah So you got to celebrate that, but also the fact Terry and I always say that everybody makes hits. And what we mean by that is we just try to make good music. The everybody that makes the hits are the fans, the people that go out and buy it. In our day, we've been around long enough to have hits on eight tracks and cassettes, CDs, vinyl, streaming nowadays. But it's a celebration of the people. We want to say thank you and celebrate all those hits, because those hits don't happen without the people. And people like yourself, playing them, supporting what we do, and spreading the word. so people know what it is that we're doing. Terry, how do you describe the Minneapolis Sound? I think of it as being, because when I first started listening to the Minneapolis Sound, I was living in Virginia. I was a teenager. How do you describe what it is? Well, in one word, I think I would sum it up as Prince. Prince to me is the Minneapolis sound. And I say Prince because his use of synthesizers, which were kind of new at the time, and the way he positioned them in the song, he used them for hornstabs and lines, the way he played his guitar, those are the foundations of the Minneapolis sound. And he was so aggressive on every instrument. And that is part of the Minneapolis sound. Yeah, you see such passion as you watch and play. How do you describe the Minneapolis sound? I think of the word. It's just, it's funky, I guess. And I agree with Terry, though. I think it is Prince. Because when you think about synthesizers... When they first came out, it was basically sound effects. It was always things that were like, wik, quik, wik, wik, you know, it was that kind of thing. But the way that prints use synthesizers, really rather than horns. You know, if you think about horns, it was kind of the traditional thing. Like earthwind and fire. Exactly. Like earthwind and fire, it was cool in the gang or a lot of the groups. It was horn sections. And...

Prince basically took those same melodies and those types of things that a horn section would play. He would do it on synthesizers. And so I think that was the thing that made that really different, made the sound really different, but also the infusion of really the gumbo, if you will, or I guess we're in Minnesota, the smorgasbord, if you will, of, you know, rock guitar against a funky beat with a funky bass and kind of taking all those ingredients and putting them together. And so I think, you know, if there's, if you think of the Minneapolis sound as a tree, Prince is the trunk of the tree. And the rest of us are all kind of the branches. We all kind of do it different ways. We incorporate some of those same, you know, lessons and sounds into what we do. But it all starts the foundation as Prince. So take me to Saturday, August 29th, at the grandstand at the State Fair. What will this sound and be like? What can I expect? Well, the way we try to put it is in the three hours that we're going to be making music, we want you to experience every emotion that you can possibly feel. Happiness, sadness, joyfulness. At the end of the day, hopefulness. because I think that's what music does. I think it allows you to experience all of those, you know, reminisce about the good times, all the different things that have happened in your life. But then hopefully when you walk out, you feel energized, you feel, and I think you feel part of a, the beautiful thing is a community that's going to be there because the Minnesota State Fair allows us the opportunity to play these songs. And as we... as we have the TikTok generation of people that listen to the songs. You know, our songs are on TikTok, which is a great thing. Is that flattering? It is very flattering. And we hope those people that hear those songs, they're hearing them in a different way than we did them, but they're going to still hear those songs and go, oh, wait, that's where that song came from. And I think those moments of, aha, I think those are really important. But I think what you'll see is you're going to see, you know, grandmothers, grandfathers, aunts, uncles, cousins, nephews. It's a family thing. And I think that's the, our audience is going to be that. And that's the thing I'm looking forward to the most. I think we're all going to be limping and sweating. Bring your dancing shoes. Bring your dancing shoes. Bring your singing voices. Yeah. Terry, before the show, I mentioned to you that over the last few years on this program, we've talked a lot about trauma and healing and music often comes up in the conversation. What have you found to be true about music in terms of healing us and taking us through emotions or taking our mind someplace else when we need just some rest? Music is the divine art. It is a very healing part of our life. I mean, you can think in reflection. Music is part of your DNA and the soundtrack of your life. You remember everything, even starting at your alphabet, to music. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. In kindergarten, right? Yes. So from there, everything else you do in life becomes a musical journey. It's part of your DNA. So when you hear these songs, like you hear a Saturday love. Now, when you heard that...

it meant one thing to you or you might have heard it in a different part of your life it means another thing to you and there's so many songs that are like that especially in our catalog that people hear like and they like it but they go back later and say man I didn't know that's what the lyrics meant they go deeper it may change in overtime just over time everything changes a little bit because you live that piece of life that it helps you understand and appreciate what's been said more. Makes you think. Yeah. Think and feel. Well, and those songs actually give you a way to express whatever you're feeling is that you can't get out sometimes. And that outlet is very, very important. So like in a couple in a romantic relationship, like, okay, I'm, whoops. Sorry about that. Oh, like, okay, I know you're mad at being baby, but I don't want to apologize. Let me play this song. You hear probably stories like that, right? Can you stand in the rain? All right. To our listeners, as I talk with Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis and knock over my microphone. And, you know, we're going to play some of the songs that they have produced. I want to hear from you, too. Yes, you can call in. I want to know what's your favorite song produced by Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis. And tell me why. What questions do you have for this power? repair. You can pick up the phone and call us at these phone numbers. It's 651-2276, 6,000. Again, that's 651-227, 6,000. Or you can call us at 800-242-2828. And Terry, Jimmy, we have somebody on the phone already in Eden Prairie listening. This is Shelley on the phone. Hi, Shelly. What do you want to tell us about some of this good music? Hey, thanks for having me. First of all, thank you guys for sharing your talent with the world. I do have my tickets for the 29th. I'm excited about the lineup. I'll be singing along with everything. Blade congratulations on your world deserve Hall of Fame induction. Oh, thank you. I was wondering, yes, I watched that. I was wondering who you wished you would have produced. Was there someone you missed out there in the world or, you know, maybe it's passed since, you know, you started all this? And my second question is I'm searching for that perfect mother-son breakout dance song. I know it's going to be something that... is from your world for my son's wedding in April. Okay, Shelly, I have a question. What is one of your favorite songs that Jimmy and Terry produced? Oh, I love Rhythm Nation. I wish I could dance better to it. I was always an expressive dancer, so I like nasty. And I love all the Bal de Beau. I like that hard dance music. I can't say that I have a favorite. I do like Johnny Gild, I'd be the right way. I like the stuff that I can sing and dance too. Okay, Shelly. So I think that two questions. Is there someone that you wish you had had a chance to work with and it didn't happen? Is that the first question? Yeah. Well, the person that comes to mind is Whitney Houston.

We, Clive introduced us to Whitney long ago when she was first starting off. But Clive, who is, you know, unfortunately passed away. Clive Davis. Yeah, Clive Davis. And he, um... But his whole thing was he always wanted us to do demos. He would always say, do a demo of the song and, you know, whatever. And Terry and I were, we were anti-demo. We were like, whatever it is that we put down on the tape, back in those days, or it was just tape. Explain to us, not in the music industry. What do you talk about when we say a demo? So a demo would be like if you had an idea for a song. Okay. And you'd make just enough to show somebody the idea. It would be like a sketch of something. Not the complete thing. Not the complete thing. And then of course if they liked it, then they'd say, oh, we like this. Go in and record it or go in and finish it. The way we always worked was whatever we created in the studio. You basically, the demos are what we did. That was turned into the actual songs. So we weren't really used to doing demos because it was kind of a two-step process. You did the demo, then you tried to recreate what you had done on the demo on the real recording. And that never worked because what you did first was always the better version. So that kept you from working. So yeah. So we never really saw eye to eye on that. And toward the end of... Well, we didn't know toward the end of her life, but she was going to make an album that was sort of a comeback album. And our idea was rather than go on, you know, Oprah or go on to shows to talk about whatever you would interview, let's take whatever those thoughts are, make songs out of them. And then that album becomes basically your interview. But vocally and singing the melodies of these lyrics. Because it's not, as Terry likes to say, it's not what you say, it's the tone. So whatever it is that she would want to say in an interview, let's put that melody and chords around it and let's do it like that. And she was into the idea of doing that. Clive wasn't, but she was into it. And that was one that I wish we would have got a chance to do. Terry, what about you? Anyone you wish you... Had had a chance to work with or would still like to work with? Well, I'm sure there are a lot of people, I guess, undiscovered that... You know, one day I will meet. But Janelle Monet would be the person just because I think she embodies the spirit of Minneapolis. I mean, I just see that. I don't know why. But I think we could think of some great, great music for her. And Shelly needs a wedding song for her son. What might work?

as a good wedding for the mother-son dance, she's asking us. Maybe we can think about it. I love song. Actually, Terry mentioned one that was interesting from our Jam and Lewis album, The Next Best Day, which I think is an interesting. Boys to Men, yes. Boys to Men, yeah, that's an interesting song. All right. Well, let's listen to some music. As we talk about Made in Minnesota, I want to play some of the hit songs that you've produced over the last five decades. And we want to talk about Janet Jackson. You two brought a young Janet Jackson here to the Twin Cities to work at your recording studio flight time. I think it was in 1985. Let's talk about the album Control and what was going on in Janet Jackson's life. And in your lives, when you work together, how did this collaboration come about? no control. It produced several hits that came out in 1986. So tell us about a young Janet Jackson being here in the Twin Cities. Well, Janet was a huge fan of the time. And she actually came to one of our shows in Long Beach, California, her and her mom. They were like sitting front row. And we did our show. We got a chance to meet her afterwards. And then she signed with A&M Records. And there was a gentleman there, John McLean, who was the ANR person there. And he had actually signed us up to work with a different artist on the label. And that artist didn't want to work with us. So he said, Who else do you want to work on that's on the label? And he faxed, this is fax machine days. We're telling our age. Yes, he faxes the list. And we go down the list and our fingers both stop at the same name, Janet Jackson. And we said, John, we'd like to do Janet. He said, oh, okay, cool, a couple of songs. And we said, no, we want to do the whole album. And he said, you do? You know? And we said, yeah. And what we felt was with Janet... When she was younger, she was very, I always called her very feisty, like she had all this attitude. But on the two albums that she had made before, we weren't really hearing that attitude. So we thought if we could make music that was aggressive, that could bring that attitude out, that that would make the great album. And then lyrically... She was moving out of, on her own. She was, you know, her dad was not managing her anymore. So there was a lot of changes in her life. But bringing her to Minneapolis was pivotal because it was the first time, I think, that she had to kind of get herself around. Like, we just got her a car to drive. There was no drivers. There was not bodyguards and that kind of thing. She'd have to, you know. Thomas guide, no GPS, so I'm going to say another thing. But she's free. She had to get herself, yeah, she had to drive herself from the hotel to the studio, to the blockbuster video, to the sushi place or whatever. But she had to be independent. So as this independence was happening for her, that's what the songs became. And we just sat and hung out with her for the longest time before going to the studio. And she said, when are we going to start working? And we said, oh, we started working.

We showed her the opening lyrics to control. When I was 17, I did what people told me, did what my father said, and let my mother mold me. I'm going to pause you here because we, producer Nikiel Kamarin and I, put together a little audio montage of some of the hits from the album Control and Janet Jackson. So let's listen to that for a couple of minutes. Cool. Don't I'm sorry, Jimmy, it sounds better when Janet sings it. Oh, I told me. I totally agree. Okay. So again, just some of the hits songs by Janet Jackson from that album produced by Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis in the late 80s, recorded in Minneapolis at Flight Time Studio. So, you know, that's just, I mean, Terry, you describe it. You're taking me through all these emotions like, you know, what have you done for me? You nasty. But then when I think of you. Happy, happy. Happy. what a producer does. When I say, you know, Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis produced that, what did you write the words? Did you write the music? What did you do? Well, we did a little bit of all of that. But I don't know, when you say production, we do make decisions for the recording. Who's going to play on it? What the repertoire is going to be. Then we happen to be writers and musicians. So we play on it and we write the song. We make chili. Yes, we do. Well, we make chili because people get hungry and it's kind of just... It's full service. It's full service. But producers pretty much are the brain trust of the project. Yeah. And I was going to say, too, it's kind of like you become the psychiatrist, the psychologist. Yes. The relationship between an artist and a producer is probably as close as you could possibly get, you know, other than, you know, if you're married, because they have to trust you and they have to be able to express their emotions to you and all of those things. And if you were to compare it, what a producer's role is, it's kind of like a director on a film. You know, you have somebody that writes the script. But then the director is the one that gets the performances out of the actors. And it's kind of like we want to get the best performance out of the artist. So that's the producer's job. So it's professional problem solving. So you may be coaching the singer saying, you know, like louder, slower, or linger on this word a little bit, or to a musician, you know, less of this, more, that faster, slower. What did Janet Jackson think of this album when it was done?

Do you remember? Yeah, she loved it. She was very proud of it, except the very last song, Funny How Time Flies. Yeah. She would always fade it out before it got to the end of it, because it was kind of sensual at the end of it. And she said she was like, ah. Yeah. Yeah. She would always, she said when she played it for her mom, she would always fade it out before the end of it happened. But no, she was, she was very proud of it. Okay, we're talking with Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis, who are back in Minnesota, getting us all ready for a big concert at the Minnesota State Fair coming up on Saturday, August 29th. Tickets are still available. You don't want to miss this. You have worked with plenty of artists who are not R&B. artists. The British pop group, the Human League, comes to mind. And I want to take a moment to play a song that you produced for that group that was a big hit in the U.S. and in the UK. Let's listen to Human. Music.

dry your eyes wipe your tears I never like to see you He messed up, didn't he? I don't know what that song means. The song Human by the Human League, produced by Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis, released in 1986. How did this come about? They're over in the UK, right? They had been successful. They had that... A little, that provocative song. Don't you want me, baby. Don't you want me baby. Yeah, that's the Human League. Now they've messed up. They're human. What's the story tale? How did you come to work with the Human League? Well, John McLean again, once again gave us a call because Human League was making an album and they were trying to mimic a Jammin' Lewis style. So he said, why don't you just work with Jam and Lewis? Right. Call him up. So. We said, yeah, we would love to do it. So they came over from Sheffield, England. They came to Minneapolis. And it was a bit of culture shock. Right? Well, what? Because it was cold? Or was it was more than that? It was cold and just, you know, these are British people. They didn't live like in London and the big city. They lived in small Sheffield, England. And then they came to the city with two black guys from Minneapolis. And it was different. And so we had to figure each other out in terms of... what we wanted and how we wanted to go about things. And so in our, I guess, ironic mind, Don't You Want Me, Baby was really, really robotic. And we wanted to do some. That was their first big hit. And this is about five years later. Here we come with human. What is that song about? And who wrote these words? Or what role did you play in this? Did you write these words? Yes, I did. Oh, okay. Yes. So I wanted to. Write something really heartfelt. And so I thought this was really good. It took like a week to record the vocal. Like I wanted to get him to feel comfortable. Emotion. Phil Oakey, who was the singer, to feel really emotionally grounded in it. It's a beautiful song. I love it. Yes. So we had a problem though. Once we got the song recorded, Lisa Keith. who was our studio background singer and myself, we sang the background. And the girls in the group had a problem with Lisa singing the background. They said, we don't like that other girl on this song because they wanted to sing the background. But Lisa sounded so beautiful in there. We didn't want to take her off. So we had a little issue. So the dilemma was to the point where...

We almost had to take the song off the album. Hmm. But this is the hit that was one of the hits on the album. That's what they said. The lesson in this, it's about the music. It ain't about your relationships and you guys squabbling. What's in the best interest of the song? Is that what won? Yeah. In the end. Here comes the epilogue. Yeah. All right. Well, let's take another phone call from a listener. We're talking with Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis home in Minnesota, getting ready for a big concert at the Minnesota State Fair coming up on August 29th, a long list of artists who will be with them, special guests performing. But I want to know what's your favorite song produced by Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis? And tell me why. 651-227,000 is the number you can call or 800 242-28. Let's go back to the phone lines in Minneapolis. This is Damon, listening this. morning and holding on damon what do you want to share with us um first off i got to say i love you miss angela but uh thank you jim jim jimmy jim like y'all got to be the most humble superstars like ever Like, I want to tell you guys that first off, like, y'all just so cool. So they even be talking to y'all, like, I'm kind of fanning out. Right? Me too, Damon. I'm trying to, like, be calm. But come on with it. What's your song? What's your song? What's your song? What's the song you love? Oh, my God. Which song do I love? Yeah. Angela. Um. My all-time favorite, oh, man. Man, there's so many. I would say sensitivity by Ralph Tresbyn is the first one that. Okay. That I, you know, because I love Ralph. Ralph. Rolf Tresman, sensitivity. Any audition and, you know, all of them, all of them. But I want to ask you guys about tender love because I heard that that's one of the first songs y'all wrote. Or I mean, I produced. Well, it was one of the first ones that, you know, mainly people would come to us for funky songs. Right. And the artist is Force MD. Force MD. Right. Turn to love. And this was a case where they came to us and they needed a ballad for a movie called Crush Groove. and for a love scene. And I remember they sent us the footage of the love scene and they said, write a song for this. And so the love scene, the way that, the version they sent us was maybe like two minutes or whatever, a little longer than that. So we just wrote it and like literally Terry did the lyrics. And like when the lyrics in Tinder Love say candles that light to dark, literally in the scene there was candles that were being lit. And we like wrote this whole beautiful song. And we didn't know the four-s-m-Ds were going to be the artist. That was their choice. That was the studio's choice. So that happens sometimes. First, sometimes you just create the song and then the artist is assigned to it. Wow. Which was actually rare for us. I mean, normally we didn't work like that. Normally we knew who the artist was and then we wrote for them. But this was a case where we just wrote the song for the scene of the movie. And then that's who they said is going to sing the song. And they were absolutely perfect to do it. I mean, they came up to Minneapolis for...

Probably just a day, I think they were here. It was just a day. Yeah. And they killed it. It was great. Do you like ballots? This is leading into one of my all-time favorite songs produced by Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis. It's Saturday Love by Shirel and Alexander O'Neill, also released in the 80s in 1985. I heard you do an interview, Jimmy, on a radio station in New York, WBLS, and you talked about how this song came to be. And then at first you're like, oh, this is kind of nerdy, and I don't think Terry's going to like it. Would you tell that story? Yeah, well, when I had come up with the idea of it, I thought, I was excited. I was like, oh, yeah, this is really cool. And then when I got to the studio, I said to Terry, I said, hey, I got this idea for a song. He said, okay, how's it go? And as soon as he said, how's it go, immediately in my mind, I was like, it's sort of like the days of the week. And he says, okay. And I'm like, yeah, you know, like Sunday, Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday. I'm kind of singing it like that. And he's like, oh, yeah, that's dope. That's dope. I like that. I like that. Did she really think that was a good idea when you first served? Oh, yeah, it was really cool. I mean, I could hear something. The chords that he played were really nice along with it. So you go on. So we end up doing the song. So anyway, we cut the song. And now Terry's doing the lyrics. And so Shirel, he gives the lyrics to Mikie Sherrill. Mikie Sherrill goes in and sings. When I think about you, she likes to. Right. So she sings it, right? Oh, girl. Yeah. So we're done with Shirel. And I said, Terry, I said, we need Alex's verse. And he goes, oh, I don't have it yet. He said, you know what, just have him sing the same lyrics as Mikie Sherrill. It's like, okay. So Alex came in and said, When I think about you, my feelings can't explain. Exactly. Yeah, same exact lyrics. So now let's listen to Alex and Cheryl sing it because it sounds better. Let's do it. Here's Saturday Love with Cheryl and Alexander O'Neill, produced by Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis.

Thank you for those lyrics. Thank you for that song. I love that song. Saturday Love by Mikie Sherrill and Alexander O'Neill, released in 1985, produced by Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis, who are my guest today. You have heard from people that they've used that now days of the week to teach kids the days of the week. Is that true? That is true. And I love that. Because, you know, as Terry said earlier, you think about your alphabet. You learn your alphabet to a melody. A, B, C, D, E, F, G. There's no way you would ever remember the order of 26 things, but you do as soon as you put a melody to it. So, yeah, so using music to teach is a great thing. Yeah, and you wouldn't even realize that's twinkle, twinkle, little stars. Yeah, right, exactly. But what I love about it, what it says about a sustaining love, the consistency, you know, and so when you were writing that those verses, or that verse, Terry, what were you thinking about? Like, what does that mean? cross the days of the week that, you know, you still love someone. Yes. You love someone every day. I mean, you have to if you love some money for real, you know, regardless of where they are, what they're doing. how they're making you feel. I always tell my kids even that. It's like, I always love you and I'll always like you. Let's take another phone call from a listener as we talk with Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis about their homecoming, a celebration of the Minneapolis Sound, a concert coming up on August 29th at the Minnesota State Fair at the Grandstand. What's your favorite song that they have produced? 651-276,000 is the number to call, or you can call us at 800 242. 2828. Let's go to Minneapolis, where Howie D is listening this morning. Hey, Howie, what did you want to share with us? Welcome home, Jimmy and Terry. Thank you. Thank you. Your song, Can You Stand the Rain with New Edition, connects us with Purple Rain. That is my favorite song you produced. And one of Prince's last song was for Freddie Gray in Baltimore. And the song for Minneapolis that I think you guys should bring back. It's Princess Seven. That's a song from Minneapolis. Okay. We use our intellect and our Savoy Affair. We stood down in Army. Okay. Thank you. That's how we. He likes Can You Stand the Rain by New Edition? That's a good one. Love it. That's a good one. And Tim, what is that song about? Is it about enduring hard times in a relationship? Yeah, definitely. We were taking it from the perspective of New Edition, which was, you know, they're a touring band. They were touring, so they were away from their loved ones a lot. And it's kind of like trying to. kind of get in their heads and kind of from their experience. You know, there's good times, there's bad times. There's hit records. There's flop records. So on and so forth. But, you know, everybody can be there when it's easy, but can you be there when the rain comes? You know, are you still going to be there? It also was an opportunity to us as a producer's kind of the producer decisions that we make is how do we integrate Johnny Gill in the group? Because this is the first Johnny Gill.

record as Johnny Gill is part of New Edition. Right. Before he goes solo. That's right. Yes. And so we thought that was a good way to do it. You know, Johnny sings the first part and then Ralph sings the next part. So you first you go, wait, who is that singing? And then when Ralph comes in, you go, oh, it's Ralph. Oh, it's new edition. And that was the way we were able to kind of integrate Johnny into the group. What has it been like? I mentioned to you, I was out of town. I went home to Virginia to see my family over the weekend. Tell me about coming home. My social media feeds, I'm on the plane coming back. You have been everywhere the last few days. You were at the Black Chamber of Commerce event. You went to a cookout at Sabathany Community Center. You've visited with friends and people who've known you across your lives. What does that feel like to come back to where it all started? Always feels good to be home, you know. Home is where the people you love live, man. And I tell you, Minneapolis is that place, man. The people here are so wonderful to us, man. And it's always also a place that is hard to gain, I guess, I call it acceptance. But... We've been over the years, man, just to be consistent. And the people here are so consistent. And all the people that we work with love coming here. Yes. Really? You get feedback? Yes. Because the Minnesota NICE is a real thing. Right. Yeah. And people feel. secure here because people know how to leave people alone. What do you mean? Like respect privacy? Respect your privacy. That's good. You know, you'll get an occasional person that'll get out of line. But most people, man, they see you and, you know, they just want to say hi and see how you're doing. And do you need anything? And they keep it pushing. And it's really cool. And, Jimmy, last night, you were at an event last night with your dad, with cornbread Harris? Yes. Yeah. Yeah. So Cornbread plays. He does the Church of Cornbread every Sunday at 5 o'clock at Schooner Tavern. And so I went and actually got a chance to play with him last night, which was a lot of fun. But yeah, it was amazing. He's 99 years old. And in a couple of weeks, he's actually going to be celebrating 99 and a third. So he's counting down to 100, you know. But, yeah, so that was a lot of fun to play with him. And Terry got to see him play. I don't think Terry had seen him play before. No, it was amazing. It was amazing to watch him perform and even more amazing to see him perform with Jimmy. That was, like, ridiculous for me. I told... cornbread that I said, man, you are so amazing. He said, it takes a lot of years to be this amazing. I love that. So I'm going to use that. And when you sneak in and out of Minnesota or when you come back to visit, where do you stay? Do you stay with friends? Do you stay with family? What do you like to stay when you come back to Minnesota? Different places? Yeah. No, we have our kind of our home away from home is...

Well, I shouldn't say because people are going to come to see us. Because we'll be looking for you. But no, there's a, there's a beautiful property called the canopy that's kind of home for us. And canopy Hilton. Canopy Hilton, yeah. It's beautiful. So tell me, as you think about the rehearsals for this, how will rehearsals work when you have all these different recording artists who don't work with each other, who are fans of each other, but you all have to do a show? Like, what will the next couple of weeks look like as you prepare for this concert on August 29th? Well, one of the things we'll do is we come up with arrangements for all of the songs. And how many songs are we talking about, maybe? About 50. Wow. About 50 songs. Okay. And, you know, there's, John McLean had a saying, you don't have to eat the whole cow to know that it's beef. So we're kind of got to, we're going to take the approach where you're going to hear, it's going to be a tasting. You know, you might hear some of the songs. You won't hear the whole song. You won't hear the whole song, but you're going to hear a lot of everything. So everybody's going to get something. And then, of course, the funny thing is even if we do 50 songs, there's going to be 50 songs, people will go, why didn't you do that song? But we're going to, but that's the thing. So we do the arrangements, and then we send the arrangements to each of the artists individually so that they can learn that. And then when we all get together, they already have learned the arrangement. And then we can always tweak on site, but that's kind of the idea of what we do. How do you see rehearsals going or what would you like to see? I think you mentioned before when you've done some concerts similar to this, like the residency that you have in Las Vegas that's coming back. It's been extended through October at the Venetian Hotel. What have you learned about artists coming together and working together with you? We have such great artists, friends. that it's just a really simple thing. Like, these are pros. They just come ready. It's like out-of-the-box ready. And pretty much all we have to do is determine what the arrangement is going to be, and we just go. And the cool thing is that everybody's fans of each other. I can see that, right. So, like, for instance, you know, Yolanda Adams is a fan of Ann Nesby. So when they get in a room together, it's just an amazing, you know, it's an amazing thing. So the rehearsals are kind of like almost like a fan club getting together and everybody's watching. It's fun to watch everybody watch each other as they do their thing. And everybody raises each other's level, you know, because people don't come and play around. They come in and they hit it. We were out of time, but I want to end the show with another one of my favorite songs. This song is cool. You're cool. Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis, thank you for coming home to Minnesota and sharing your vision for celebrating the Minneapolis Sound at the Minnesota State Fair. Again, details of the special concert you can find on the Minnesota State Fair website. It is on Saturday, August 29th at the grandstand 7 p.m. Long list of special guests and our guest today, Minnesota PowerP. the ultimate power pair to me. Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis. This conversation was produced by Nikiel Kumaran. Thanks for listening to a recording of my live radio show on NPR News. A reminder that if you want to catch my show in real time, tune in and call in weekdays at 9 a.m.