The big takeaways from Tuesday's primary elections

Programming supported by Topline Construction Firm, your local woman owned and operated roofing contractor, offering sustainable American-made steel roofing and siding with unmatched durability, roofing, deck, siding, and aluminum seamless gutters. More at Topline ConstructionFirm.com. Good morning. I'm Catherine Richard. I'm filling in for Angela Davis today, and you're listening to NPR News. Minnesota's primary election results are in, and the November races are up next. And there were plenty of highs and lows for the candidates last night. The closely watched DFL Senate primary put progressive politics against a more moderate approach and was one of the most expensive in state history as well. And meanwhile, the Republican governor's race tested both President Donald Trump's influence and the power of the party establishment. But all these results also tell us a lot about where things are heading, the tone, the tenor, and the strategies the campaigns will adopt going into a very busy fall. So this morning, we're talking with two political strategies. strategists about what the results reveal about Minnesota voters, the future of the state's political parties, and the road to November. And we want you to join our conversation this morning. What do you think last night's results say about Minnesota politics? What do you think your party should take away from the primaries? And do these results change how you're thinking about November? The phone lines are open. Give us a call at 651-227-6,800-242-2828. in our guests we have this morning. Amy Fredrickson specializes in media relations and crisis communications and is a principle for momentum advocacy. That's a Minnesota-based lobbying firm. She has been a Republican political strategist and was the first woman to serve as majority leader in the Minnesota House. Good morning, Amy. Good morning. But just one correction. Senate. Sorry. First majority. Okay. So to be clear, not enough sleep last night. Same. It says Senate and I apologize. Okay. Same. We also have Ryan Winkler. He is a business and technology lawyer who served 13 years in the Minnesota House representing St. Louis. Park in Golden Valley. And he was the DFL majority leader from 2018 to 2022. He's also the CEO of Crooked Beverage Company. That's a Minnesota hemp THC beverage brand. Thanks for being here, Ryan. Sure. Happy to be here. Okay. We're going to get into each race. We're going to talk about money. We're going to cover a lot of ground. But I did just want to start by getting your big takeaways from last night. Amy, I will start with you. If there's one thing that you think people should be thinking about going into November based on last night's results.

What is it? Well, you know, I'll just cover kind of on the GOP side. I think the big winner and the big story from the night was Lisa Demuth winning. She not only didn't have the party endorsement for the first time in my entire life that I can remember. And she did not have Trump's endorsement. And yet and still, she prevailed in a primary double digit win. And she's in rarefied air. There's just not been, if you look across the country, just a handful of folks that have won against a Trump endorsed candidate. And she won handily. So big win there. And also, Tofoya ran away with that race. So, you know, huge wins on the GOP side. And also, first woman governor is a lock, ladies. Yeah, it's going to happen no matter what. Let's just talk a little bit more about Damath. When you're talking to your friends in the Republican circles today. I mean, are people happy? Obviously, the party was sort of divided, but what are you hearing from folks? You know, look, I think that I think that you saw like a strong, strong support for her. And if you couple her numbers with Kendall Claus's number, the GOP overwhelmingly did not support the Trump endorsed candidate, which was Mike Lindell. And there's a variety of reasons for that. But overall, Minnesota Republicans have in the past, just gone their own way. They've not chosen, you know, the way the national winds are blowing. In 2016, Trump came in a distant third in the Minnesota caucuses, a distant third. And we saw that play out, just very independent-minded Republicans that I also think that for 20 years, we have not won a statewide race. And we have grown tired of that because if you're not winning statewide, you are not at the table, you do not have a say what's going on. You do not have a strong say in St. Paul. And we wanted candidates that were electable that could win, that could raise money. And we've got that. We're going to come back to Lindell and Trump's endorsement a little bit later on. Okay, Ryan, what about you? What's your big takeaway from last night? Well, on the Democratic side, I think we are seeing in Minnesota the same phenomenon that's been playing out around the country, which is a big progressive surge and a strong message that is opposing. what a second term Trump administration stands for. This term has been about Trump corruption, about breaking down norms and the rules of law, attacking the Constitution. And I think Democrats are looking for candidates who are the strongest antidote to what Trump represents, and that's why we're seeing this big progressive surge. I think it's interesting that Peggy Flanagan, the lieutenant governor, did not come into a close race like we saw in the Wisconsin Governor's race next door or the Michigan Senate race last week. And I think that's because she is a much more effective politician. She's better at bridging divides within the DFL party. She knows how to do that. She can capture progressive energy, but not turn off people who are worried about some of the more extreme elements of the Democratic Socialists. So I think it was a success all around for progress. in Minnesota last night. It's interesting to see what will happen with Minnesota Republicans. That may be a bit of a guide to the future for them. But I don't think 2026 is going to be their year. Okay. All right. We already have a call coming in from Kathy and St. Paul. Kathy, what do you want to share with us?

Yes, I was an election judge yesterday. It's a long day, 530 to 9, but very well worth it. Anybody who wants to see what goes on in the inside, it is definitely worth it. Met fascinating people, and it was a turnout twice as many people as had been predicted. And so it really shows that people felt that they had some important thing to say. to be part of this. Also, if there's any challenge to, you know, to say that there was any corruption, there is no way. So I saw how, you know, if you were not registered and the whole process, there was no way that anybody could get in and vote. illegally. Thank you so much, Kathy. I want to, I want to, you're bringing up something important, which is enthusiasm. You're both not in your head here. Amy, I'll start with you and Ryan. I want you to get, I mean, was this was, were voters enthusiastic about voting in a primary that typically people might be traveling, you know, it's the middle of the summer, you know, it's not necessarily top of mind sometimes. Yeah, yeah. So thanks Kathy for being an election judge. Always be sure to thank your election judges. Those folks are working real hard. And, yeah, you saw enthusiasm. We had to have two big races, right, on the DFL side, it was the U.S. Senate race. On the Republican side, the GOP race, lots of energy around those and lots of opinions around those races and a lot at stake for November and beyond. And so you saw the big turnout. And I think... You know, I think from the DFL side, you sort of expected the energy, given it's the interim for Trump. It's, you know, Operation Metro Surge, kind of like, but, but for the Republicans, I was also pleased to see the excitement and the energy and sort of, and again, kind of choosing their own way. So, which bodes well, I think, for Republicans, even in November. I mean, that could be. The turnout was strong for Republicans, but it was incredible for Democrats. The number of votes coming out compared to 2018, the last time there was a Trump midterm, were significantly more. It was vastly more than 2022 the last time we had a midterm election. So Democrats, and we've seen this, the turnout at protest, the turnout at precinct caucuses, the energy among Democrats across the country and in Minnesota. is really off the charts this year. And I think it ties into what Kathy's talking about voter integrity, voting integrity. A lot of Democrats feel like democracy itself is on the line that there is nothing that Donald Trump wouldn't do in order to win an election. We've seen extreme forms of gerrymandering. We've seen the kind of corruption that's just flagrant coming out of this White House that we've not seen before. And so Democrats are in turning out in part. to protect the right to vote itself. And I think what's great about last night is aside from sore loser Mike Lindell, nobody's questioning the results. There's no doubt whatsoever about the strength of Minnesota's electoral system and the, you know, you could hear it in Kathy's voice. These are regular people who are doing a good job in a system that is very well run. Yeah.

Okay, I want to turn to the Craig Flanagan race because obviously that was a marquee race last night, just to get our listeners up to speed if you weren't paying attention. Lieutenant Governor Peggy Flanagan won over second congressional Representative Angie Craig to run for U.S. Senate as on the DFL ticket. She will be replacing Tina Smith, who's not going to run again. It was a bruising primary campaign. It was very expensive. And it really pitted the progressive. wing of the DFL against the moderate wing. But Ryan, you know, as much as Craig was positioning herself as a moderate and Flanagan was, you know, touting her progressive credentials, is that an oversimplification of what was going on in this race? I mean, what's your take there? I think it is a bit of an oversimplification. The fact is that both Lieutenant Governor Flanagan and Congresswoman Craig are members of the DFL establishment. Peggy is certainly more on the progressive side, but she's served as lieutenant governor for eight years with Tim Walz. There's been a lot of progressive wins, but there's been a lot of compromise and negotiation and governing that's been going on. I think what is the real credit for Peggy is that she was able to position herself as a candidate that represented hope and change and a strong rejection of the Trump administration. And that was something that Congressman Craig just couldn't do in this election. election. Congressman Craig in 2024 got way more votes in her district than Kamala Harris and Tim Walz did. She, in many ways, in a tough district, represents what Democrats need to be. But that's not what this election was about. Well, it feels like bipartisanship is not necessarily something that Democrats are rewarding right now. You look at a very close race in Wisconsin last night. The progressive there did lose. And then, you know, one in Michigan, where the progressive won. What do you make of that? I think this is a lot like the Democratic Tea Party moment where once you have decided that the system is flawed, that people can't get a fair shake, and that the other party is not trustworthy and a partner in governing, suddenly bipartisanship starts to sound a lot like surrender. And that is something that Democrats absolutely were not going to do this year. They were not looking for candidates who were going to surrender to Donald Trump. You know, without Trump in the White House, I'm not sure that that's what is going to animate Democrats in the future. But right now, that is what this moment is all about. All right. I want to play a clip now from Flanagan's victory speech last night. Here is what she said. So if you want to help us beat mega in November, go to peggyflanagan.com. Because there. desperate to give Trump another yes sir senator to do his bidding and another Republican truck full of yes sir senators who will say yes sir to anything Donald Trump wants and we are not going to give them a Republican majority friends we're not going to let them flip this seat So then Flanagan went on to say that when Minnesotans fight together, they're unstoppable. I mean, I read this. It gets at what you were saying earlier about how this feels like a referendum on Trump for Democrats right now. I also hear in there, you know, just sort of this appeal to the independence and like, you know, thoughtfulness of Minnesota voters. But also I hear an appeal to people who might have supported Craig here to say, we got to get together now. Let's set aside our differences.

Maybe easier said than done, Ryan? I don't think so. I think that Democrats are going to be very much united behind their candidates. And as I alluded to earlier, Lieutenant Governor Flanagan is going to be very good at the diplomacy of bringing the party together. Yes, I mean, I think the nastiness that we saw in this primary, a lot of that emanated from the kind of online left. And there are even still today people who are gloating over defeating Angie Craig. But that's not going to be the tone from Lieutenant Governor Flanagan. And that's not how this campaign is going to run. And Democrats are generally good at coming together. And there's no bigger motivator for Democrats to join hands and fight hard together than Donald Trump, and especially in Minnesota in this year. So, Amy, you know, I live in greater Minnesota. I talk to a lot of people who live outside the metro. Even at the DFL convention in Rochester, I was talking to delegates, who were very worried that Peggy Flanagan. couldn't appeal to voters in greater Minnesota, particularly because of the issues around fraud within the Walls administration. How important do you think that message is going to be once we really hit the campaign trail? Well, it will be the number one. message coming from the Michelle Tofoya camp. It already has been. So a couple things. One, you know, you cannot take away from Peggy Flanagan and her team. They were outspent 10 to 1 and she won, you know, 20 points. So huge. And by the way, she also went in Greater Minnesota. Getting back to that just a little bit, she got out front early on the Lake and Riley vote. And I don't think Angie Craig ever recovered from that. And I think the idea was, and then you couple that with Metro Surge and the extreme example of overreach by this Trump administration. And that, I think people thought, well, that's Metro, right? But it isn't. Going back to your Greater Minnesota question. If you're talking about Rochester, if you're talking about Austin, if you're talking about Wilmer, folks saw that reverberating through their communities in Greater Minnesota too. And so looking at the map, you know, kind of the idea was, well, will there be sort of an Angie Craig wave that comes in when Greater Minnesota came in? And it just wasn't happening because Peggy played both. Now, the fraud issue was never really vetted in this campaign. Angie Craig tiptoed around it. Michelle Tofoil will not. And that is going to be the major issue in this campaign. And we, I hope we'll get to it. But I want to talk about like the broader implications for the U.S. Senate because this race is now open. The map opens for the Republicans. And the Democrats will be spending money where they did not intend to spend in the U.S. Senate race, which, you know, was starting to look like the Democrats had a real shot at it. And this seat is going to be a real problem for Chuck Schumer.

Yeah. Okay. And Ryan, what about? I'm not sure that I buy that. I think in this era, all politics is national, the reverse of what it used to be. I don't think that there's any chance that Minnesota voters are going to deliver a Republican to the U.S. Senate in the second Trump midterm. There's no precedent for that happening in Minnesota's modern history. Yes, that will be the attack. Fraud will be the attack. I think it is. Can Flanagan shake that off? Sure, she's the lieutenant governor. I mean, the lieutenant governor has the advantage of not having a great deal of responsibility and I can kind of pick and choose what to take credit for and what to distance herself from, which I think she has done pretty effectively. Tim Walz currently has pretty low approval. I think that will be a negative, but I don't think it will come close to being enough of a hit on the lieutenant governor to deny her a seat in the United States Senate. How do you see this issue playing up and down the ballot, too? Because Amy Klobuchar obviously has really tried to distance herself from the same. Yeah. Well, look, I think it is. I appreciate Ryan trying to say it, but there's zero percent chance that Becky's going to be able to just distance herself from the Wallace Flanagan administration. They were, there was no light between that administration. for six of the eight years of their race. And the idea that all politics is local still holds. Yes, there are national implications. But in every election, an issue rises locally that can like offset all of that. We saw that in the supposed red wave that was supposed to come in the last election. And it really just hit Florida and then died on the vine. The Democrats had a sweep that nobody expected. But Florida was. a separate island in that red wave. And that, and that just is what goes down. So, um, And so I would just say for the lieutenant governor, the answers that she's given on the fraud issue, I think she's going to have to work on an answer for that. Like there's just no way to get around it. She has not been vetted fully on that. It didn't come up in this race, hardly at all. But it is not one that's going to be able to gotten around. Yeah. I mean, I think that might be more true if the lieutenant governor were running for governor of Minnesota, but she's not. She's running for the U.S. Senate. And that is a different kind of an election. It is an explicit. national election. Minnesotans tend to, and I think this is true around the country, they think which side nationally am I voting for when I pick a candidate? If we were, so the downside on fraud is probably going to be further down ballot. We may see that in the race for Attorney General. We may see that in legislative races, but I don't think it is going to affect the top of the ticket in the U.S. Senate race. And certainly Amy Klobuchar is running very hard and has the credibility on the issue of fraud as a former prosecutor. she's going to help inoculate state-level campaigns for DFLers on the fraud issue too. If you're just joining our conversation, we are talking about last night's primary election results. We want you to join our conversation. What do you think about last night's results?

What do you make of them? What do you think it means for how politics are moving forward in Minnesota? And what issues do you hope to hear about from the candidates between now and then? Give us a call at 651-227-6,000 or 800-242-28-28-28. I want to get to a call now from Alexander in Red Wing. Alexander, what do you want to share with us? Hi, can you hear me okay? We sure can, yeah. Okay, thanks for take my call. The question is about the two individuals that are the selected candidates for governor, Amy Klobuchar and Lisa Dimuth. I have been sending emails to their candidacies asking them to support the Minnesota Health Plan, which eliminates insurance companies and lawyers from our health care system. Everybody's in. everybody pays everybody has health care you'll lose your job or you go somewhere else you still have health care i don't trust Amy Klobuchar because she's a wall street democrat just like Tim Walz Tim Walz had a trifecta and we still did not see a health care program for everybody so i hate to say this but I don't trust the Democrats in what they say and what they're going to do. And Ryan, you were there. Why didn't we get health care when you were there? Thank you, Alexander. Yeah, thank you. So good point in the sense that we are hearing a lot about health care, this election cycle, particularly from Democrats. It does seem to be a message that's really resonating with people. it plays into the affordability message that we've been hearing. Is there realistically anything that can be done or are these just sort of empty promises we're hearing to get through the season of the election season and get on the ballot for November? I mean, the big issue, of course, is just affordability. Republicans nationally really tried to undercut the Affordable Care Act by not continuing the tax credits for people who are buying insurance in the private market. That really does hurt. access to coverage. To Alexander's question, there's been a plan and proposed for many years to create a single-payer health care model for Minnesota. The challenge with it is that there is no financing mechanism proposed, and it's 20% of our state's economy. So it's not just a bill that you can pass. It's a significant undertaking to even begin to do that at the state level. Nationally, health care is, I mean, I think of the assassination of a United Health CEO and the cheers that that got. I mean, there's a visceral feeling in America that our health system is just... making a lot of people rich and not providing care. But there aren't a lot of great solutions that are big picture enough to capture people's imagination. It tends to be a lot of small bore engineering of finances, which are a hard thing to communicate on the campaign trail. It's complicated stuff. Yeah. Yeah. So here's where Ryan and I are going to agree on some things, right? So single payer, the idea of it, which some now are touting, and I get it because that's the one solution that...

reverberates and sounds good and, you know, DFLers are kind of jumping on that. But the expense of it and the undertaking is just, is... think about like universal school meals on steroids, right? Like it's just, it's, the cost is staggering on it. But this is also an area where Republicans and Democrats come together, right? Like if you talk to people about their health insurance, you've talked to people about their providers, if you talk to people about like the push and the pull and the care and the cost and also doctors and nurses inside the system, like. There just seems to be no one happy with what's going on in our health care system. And so I think that there's a real opportunity. around that issue. The problem is, again, it's sort of like we're all frustrated or, you know, you all feel strongly about something. But to communicate what it would actually take, it's bigger than a campaign slogan. Yeah. We're going to take one more call here before we go to headlines. We have Kevin in Elysian on the line. Kevin, what do you want to share with us? Can you hear me? Sure can. Yeah, I just want to say we are so over Donald Trump. We got Republicans, we got Democrats, and we got independents. Please people, don't forget the independence. I'm an independent. Nobody wants to care. Nobody cares about Donald Trump. He's only got one more year left in office. How about we focus on policies? People get up. Say what you're going to do. Then we'll check another other candidate. Say what they're going to do. Let's all be nice to each other and be grownups. And let's just go with people who are putting forth good policy and common sense, I might add. We are so over Trump. It's about Trump. Let's all fight Trump. I went to go on the Democratic, their 2026 primary policy list, and they got 24 thing on there. There's nothing even to look at. Thank you. You know, Kevin, we got to take a break for news, and I want my guests to have a chance to respond. You're both sort of nodding here because I think we're all hearing kind of a frustration that we hear a lot with voters right now, which is like, can y'all just get something done, please, for the love, you know? Yeah, and that's why I'm hopeful for this race between Senator Amy Klobuchar and Speaker Damath. I think this is going to be, I think you're going to get your wish, a caller. I think that this is going to be an issue oriented because both of these women are incredibly strong on policy, and it's going to be. a really fun race to watch. Well, I think it will be. I don't know if it will get the attention that the Senate race will, because in our information environment that we're in, usually it is the loudest, craziest voices that get the most attention, not the people who are proposing a sensible response to housing or health care or the things that actually affect people's lives on a day-to-day basis. So we touched on this in the beginning a little bit, Amy. I want to talk a little bit about the GOP battle to be on the ballot for governors.

this fall. We've talked about Lisa Demuth. We've talked about Kendall Qualls, who had the party endorsement. We've talked a little bit about Mike Lindell, who had an endorsement for Trump. The two endorsed candidates, the Trump endorsed candidate, the party endorsed candidate, didn't make it. What does this say about endorsements in general? Right. So it wasn't even just in the governor's race. But in the U.S. Senate race, Michelle DeFoya did not have the endorsement. And she ran away with this. I mean, her race was called almost as fast as the Amy Klobuchar race. So I think here's the deal with the endorsement. And I came from the endorsement process. I have spent a lot of time on convention floors. I like the party coming together. I have no problem with an endorsement. But The caucus system and the endorsement process has become really... outdated and it becomes very, it feels very insidery, right? It's a few thousand Republicans that are insiders, insider that had to go through the caucus process and the BPOU process and all the things. And you have to pay to travel and you have to pay for a hotel room. It's expensive and it becomes very insider. A primary allows all Minnesota Republicans to have a voice and who they want. Now, I will say this, Minnesota legislature, move that primary up and August primary is ridiculous. People are going back to school to the state fair, to their cabins. It is summer. Make that earlier. It make it more relevant, make it earlier. But other than that, the primary process is really where it's at. But for the Republicans, in my time in politics, and it's been longer than I care to admit on the air here, the endorsement process has been sank or sanked. Even former Governor Tim Pawlenty could not win a primary against the Republican-adourced candidate. All of that changed last night. All of that changed with these two women, Michelle Tafoya and Lisa Demuth. And I think what it's saying is Republicans are saying enough. The DFL have been there for several, several cycles now. I think that, I think just rank and file Republicans across the state are saying, now we want something different. We have a call now from Dan and Blaine. Dan, what do you want to share? Oh, hi. Just rolled back, so I missed voting yesterday from the Sturgis rally. Oh, that sounds good. I've gone eight, nine years in a row, and if there's ever a situation where you're going to be around people that are 90% plus. pro-Trump, that is it. For the first time, there was nothing about Trump, no Trump merchandise. I didn't hear people chanting for Trump like they would in years past. Before, it's not on every block. It was every other vendor. Half their stuff was mega and Trump stuff. There was nothing, nothing for any of that one spot had leftover stuff from last year.

I got to feel that lack of enthusiasm will be felt down the ballot, especially in the midterm. Well, Dan, this observation is very relevant to what we're talking about right now because we talked about party endorsements, Amy, but we also have been talking about President Trump's endorsement of Michael Indel that clearly didn't get him very far. Is that unique to Minnesota or are we seeing voters distance themselves nationally? Look, it's still been very rare in this primary season. We have seen very few folks fight the Trump endorsement, including in Texas where Ken Paxton, the Trump endorsed candidate beat a seated longtime U.S. Senator. And I think there are some also unique flaws to the candidacy of Mike Lindell that cannot be ignored and can't be played off in this. So it's a combination of things. But I do think that Minnesota Republicans have long had a history with Trump going back to 2016 in the caucuses where he came in a distant third. And also I was watching some key districts. I was watching my home district of Wright County, which had a Trump store in downtown Buffalo. basically since 2016, and it just flowed right through to his last election. And those numbers came in for Lisa Demuth. So to what the caller was just saying about, like, you know, you wouldn't see much things more Maga than the Sturgis rally. I think there is a shift as the administration comes to an end into the final two years. And frankly, Tariffs have hit us hard. Gas prices have hit people hard. A lot of the things that the president promised, I mean, he went after Biden for inflation and here we sit. And so, you know, just the Iran war and the things that were told and promised there. All of those things start to play into it where, and even after eight years, all politicians start to like old fish, right? They start to kind of sting. Ryan, I mean, on the Democratic side, at least this cycle, you know, Peggy Flanagan did have the party endorsement. Obviously, Amy Klobuchar did have the party endorsement. Do you see any differences here? Or would you agree with Amy about the relevance of endorsements? It is interesting how the parties... A little bit flipped this year. I do think the bigger headline is that Republicans completely disregarded their party endorsement for the two marquee races that they're running this year. That's a total C change for where the Republican Party has been at for a long time. It may be a sign of returning sanity among Minnesota Republicans. It may be, and which is my guess, they are really tired of losing. Republicans this year are finally acting as though they want to win an election in Minnesota. And Democrats, to some extent, are...

of the attitude that we can't lose an election this year. And so I think, you know, success tends to make people a little bit sloppy and you lose enough times and you get hungry and you do what you need to do in order to win. I think some of that is what we're seeing on both sides this year. Yeah. Okay. We have a call now from Sarah in South Minneapolis. Sarah, what do you want to share with us? Hey, good morning. So, you know, I think that there's something to be said for when there's a CEO that runs a company and something really bad happens with that company, they have to really take the hit for that. And I just couldn't bring myself to vote for Peggy, although I'm a Walt Flanagan supporter. I looked at it pretty hard, and I thought, you know what, I just can't do it on a matter of principle alone. I think Flanagan, if she wins this thing, she's got to address that with voters like me. I will support her. But I need some trust to be regained here. I need her to, you know, address that directly. She was on the clock when that fraud issue happened with the feed my, you know, children thing. And that was really awful. So that's what I would say. Thank you so much, Sarah. I mean, Ryan, what do you think Flanagan might need to say to voters at this point on this topic? I think that she has to just continue to emphasize the fact that the administration has responded, that the legislature, the DFL legislature has passed legislation that will address it and that she cares about it. And then I think she needs to pivot to the fact that if we want to look at fraud and corruption, the White House is the chief source of it in the country right now. And I think it's pretty hard for Republicans to make the case that human services fraud in Minnesota is at the same level of a president who is enriching himself, enriching his family, who is rolling over any kind of ethical standards, firing anybody who could be a roadblock to him on corruption. protection at the national level. I just don't think this issue in Minnesota will compare, and it's a national race. It's a U.S. Senate race. So I think she has to acknowledge it. I think she has to explain what has been done to fix it and then focus the attention back on the corruptor-in-chief in the White House. Just to clarify something, Sarah, the caller, said. She mentioned the fraud in our feeding my children program. It's actually the feeding our future program just for our listeners out there. And if you are listening and want to join our conversation, we are talking about last night's primary election results. We want to hear from you. If you voted yesterday, why did you go out to vote? What do you think the results say about where Minnesota politics is going? Give us a call at 651-227, 6,000, or 800 242, 2828. I want to talk now about money, campaign spending, which always is an issue. We have the ads. But the matchup between Craig and Flanagan has been one of the most expensive in Senate history, a primary, right? Not even the actual election in November.

This is a really basic question, but why are these primary elections getting so expensive? Well, in this case, it was just the race appeared in the polls to be neck and neck for so long. And, of course, it's seen as, you know, is the former Senator Tina Smith seat. So it's seen as a DFL seat. So oftentimes those inner party sort of fights are just going to get. large, and there was just certain real fundamental differences between these campaigns. But looking ahead, this is going to be, this can continue to be an expensive race. I talked a little bit earlier and alluded to, this really opens up the map, right? Michelle Tofoya is a very attractive candidate who has a lot of backing. And she's been backed by establishment Republicans for some time. And can really raise some money. Coupled with now Chuck Schumer and the U.S. Senate Democrats are going to have to come in and spend money. So I think we're going to see. money coming in the likes that we have not seen on a statewide race, certainly in a U.S. Senate race, for maybe decades. And so just buckle up because those ads are not going to be soon off your TVs. Yeah. I mean, but no amount of money can sell a product that people don't want to buy, right? No amount of money spent on ads or... digital, you name it. Eventually, you could hire everybody with enough money who works in politics. But if the voters are not interested in what you stand for, it doesn't matter. And that's what I think the U.S. Senate primary showed. Angie Craig had all the money she could ever need to spend to do anything that she wanted, but there are limited avenues to persuade voters who just are looking for something different. I think the national environment this year will not be favorable to the report. Republicans, and it would be very close to zero chance that Minnesota will be an exception to that national trend. So I don't think, I mean, the money is the story because the money is the narrative about corruption and who's paying for what it stands for. APAC has become a stand-in on the question related to Israel. And so... The money conversation is almost like a meta-narrative about what's happening in the race and what you stand for. I'm not sure what persuasive value, though, it will have this year. Well, that's my question is like, you know, we heard a lot about Angie Craig getting money from APAC. Of course, this is a group that supports Israel. The war between Palestine and Israel and Trump's support of Israel was a big talking point during the primary. Do voters really even care? You know, are they paying close attention to where money is coming from? Is it an effective message? I don't think they're paying close attention. the money from, which kind of goes to Ryan's argument, which is how much can you spend and does it really matter? In the end, it's kind of ironic because Angie Craig took a seat that's, you know, arguably pink, right? And she turned it to a 14 point win in the last election. Dark, she turned it blue for Angie Craig. But that same kind of moderate approach, which is, you know, whether it's where money is coming from or the Lake and Riley vote or all those things. played against her in this statewide DFL primary in a really big way. So the things that she needed to do have that huge win and have that huge success in a really Republican district were not helpful, even in the second district. If you look to those numbers, those were kind of a bellwether that came in early. She basically tied with Peggy Flanagan in her own district. She needed to run much stronger in CD2 than she did. But she couldn't get the DFL in her own district to...

to decide really at all for her. It was really basically a 50-50 split between herself and the lieutenant governor. We're talking about the Senate race. I'm wondering if you think the governor's race is going to attract the same sort of attention and funding. You know, I think so. You know, well, certainly Amy Klobuchar has a war chest, that she has not had to spend because of her easy, or an easy primary, basically zero primary, that she had to run. And also, I think that Republicans nationally are going to look at this with a really new eye because of the quality of the candidates on the race, because, you know, of sort of the opportunity that surrounds Minnesota in a sea of interim voting that'll be. tough for the Republicans. I think that you're going to see some real attention paid to Minnesota. You know, I think it's great, Amy, that you can, you know, make the case for Republicans against Amy Klobuchar this year. But I mean, it's a little bit of a stretch. I mean, she is, she's, Amy is the only elected official candidate who has a positive approval rating in the state right now. And in this environment, that it's, it's not huge, right? It's not like it once was. But it's very clear that, that, that, people view Amy Klobuchar favorably. That's a remarkable achievement in an environment like this. And she did not have to ride a progressive wave to get the DFL endorsement or the nomination. Democrats know that she is a force to be reckoned with. Not everybody thinks that her brand of politics represents what they like in Democrats, but they can't deny the effectiveness of Amy Klobuchar. And personally, I'm excited because I think there's a lot of things in state government that need to be fixed and improved. And I think Amy Klobuchar is going to be a strong force for creating a much better and more effective state government. Okay. Well, we'll have you guys back on in a few months to talk about whether the money really materialized and whether this is dramatic as we thought it might be. Okay. We have lots of calls coming in and I want to get to as many as we can. We have Tom, any dinah on the line. Tom, what do you want to share? Yeah, I just want people to remember that Coya Conunson was the first congresswoman in Minnesota, the first congresswoman in the United States. I happen to be a relative and seeing the progression of women in politics for their accuracy and their energy that they're putting into this. I don't care which side of the fence you are in. Women have been in the background doing heavy lifting, assisting people, and it is so joyful to me to see women across the country taking leadership roles. Thank you so much time. I mean, yeah, we kind of buried this lead a little bit, which is we're going to have our first female governor. It's historic. Is it energizing for voters? I was so excited to see it. I knew that this could be the shape up. This is what I picked. I thought that Lisa was going to pull this out last night. And, you know, so I think about when I became the first woman Senate majority leader, this was 2011. And people would ask me, like, how does that feel for you? And I just would think, what I actually would say was, I can't believe it took this long. Like it was 2011. And here we are now.

15 years later. And I thought, and we have not, still have not had a woman gone for you to told me that 15 years ago. I would have said, no, no, no, no, no. It'll be like, how has it taken this long? You know, so thank you to the relative of Coya. Very famously, the Coya come home, right? She was not well thought of. And there was a lot of, you know, garbage she had to take. I met Nancy Brattis, the first woman to serve in the Minnesota Senate, elected under her own steam. And she would tell me stories about the Minnesota Senate. I mean, these are from the 70s. This is not ancient history. This is from like, you know, very recent history of how she was treated. And so we owe a great nod to those ladies that led the way. And I just for one, look, here's what I also love. In my opinion, these are the best candidates on the ballot. Man, woman, doesn't matter. These are the best candidates on the ballot. And for once, that... That is what mattered, right? And not, not, you know, that they were women. It's a great, it's a great, exciting piece of it. But these are the most, these are the best candidates for the ballot. And they won last night and I'm excited to see it. And I, you know, we have to acknowledge that. The politics we have today takes a lot out of the people who are candidates and elected officials. And I think the level of strength you have to display, especially as a woman with the level of vitriol that is aimed at you and the tropes that are used to tear women leaders down. I mean, it is very, very vicious. And the fact that we have so many effective women standing up in Minnesota, ready to lead, ready to take that on, ready to move us forward. It's inspirational. It's generational. It's very Minnesota. I think we can all be proud of both parties for what we've put forward this year. Okay. We have Kelsey on the line. She's in Duluth. Kelsey, what do you want to share? Hi, I just had a response to the commentary earlier on the caucus process. I was a first-time delegate this year. I went all the way to the state convention. And I just wanted to say that I don't think that it's an insider process. Over 50% of the DFL convention was first-time delegates. And I think that people are wanting to be more civically involved. And I would say that I thought it was a really empowering process where I got to bring forth resolutions and network with people and advocate for policies that I care about. And candidates as well. So thank you. And Kelsey, if I can keep you for a second, as a first time delegate, what got you interested in doing this? I mean, I think that the state of national politics as well as local issues to Minnesota, I just felt like I wanted to have more of a voice and be as involved as I could. And that was, and meet my neighbors too. Like the neighborhood precincts caucus process was so awesome to meet like a whole community of people that are like within a mile of where I live in Duluth.

that share the same values. So that was really cool. Okay. Thank you so much. Amy, you want to? Yeah. So here's what I would say, Kelsey, everything you named about the caucus process and endorsement is still what I love. And it doesn't need to be taken away. But the idea that that, that I think it's empowering. I think the resolutions are great. I think the community that you gained, all of those things can still happen. And even an endorsement can happen. But the idea that, and we all know this, that a couple thousand people. are representing and get to choose for all Minnesota Republicans or all Minnesota DFLers who's on their ballot in November just seems, that seems very incitory to me. I think all the other things you said, that's what I love about the caucus and about the endorsing process. I mean, the caucus process and the DFL side has becoming increasingly white, older college educated. And I think there's a bias in that group of people and it gets magnified through the caucus process. It doesn't necessarily represent the full range of voters that Democrats have supporting us or that we're trying to appeal to. And one thing that I've noticed in both Minnesota, Wisconsin, and Michigan is the more moderate candidates tend to do well with voters without a college degree, which is still the vast majority of people in the country. So Democrats do have to be a little bit aware of how these processes can create a bias that might not be appealing to a lot of working class voters. I want to get one more call in kind of quickly here because we're getting close to the end of the show. We have artists in Roseville artists. What do you want to share? I listened to the impaired debate between Angie Craig and Peggy Flanagan. And it was such a tough choice. But as I did other research on my own, I discovered Angie Craig language calling the Panistrian. Palestinian genocide. She referred to that as unhelpful language, and I just thought that was despicable. At the same time, I really am concerned about the Republicans using fraud against Flanagan, and I'm just super concerned that she won't be able to shake that. This is just going to be a very... scary race, I think. Thank you so much, artists. We appreciate your comment. You know, I think I hear there just... how hard maybe the decision was for her and some really, you know, thought put into how they're voting, which also seems very Minnesotan. We have about a minute and a half left. And I did just want to get from each of you, what are, what is like the big thing you're going to be looking for in coming weeks going into November? And Ryan, I'll start with you. I mean, I think, first of all, for Democrats, it's the ability to come together and consolidate around the candidates. I think it will be seeing what kind of organization Republicans are able to put together. around their candidates for Senate and governor. And then, of course, it's going to be events. It's going to be about Iran and gas prices. And all the issues that have stacked up and have been negatives, job numbers. I mean, there's all kinds of issues that are going to shape this election that we don't even know about yet. And that will be probably pretty decisive in November. Okay. Amy, what about you?

Yeah, well, I'm looking to see for the GOP, you know, you got behind these candidates last night. Are you going to continue to support? Are you going to continue to come out? Are you continue to be independent-minded Republicans, right? And not go the way. That back in the 70s was a ticket to success for the Republican Party. We'll see if it can continue. Okay. Our time is up for today. I want to thank Amy Fredrickson, who specializes in media relations and crisis communications. And Ryan Winkler, he is a business and technology lawyer who served. in the Minnesota House. This conversation was produced by Carrie Dwyer. I'm Catherine Richard, filling in for Angela Davis. I'll talk to you tomorrow morning at 9. Thanks for listening to a recording of my live radio show on NPR News. A reminder that if you want to catch my show in real time, tune in and call in weekdays at 9 a.m.