Celebrated Poet and Mission District Icon Alejandro Murguía

From Pacifica Radio in San Francisco, this is Flashpoints. I'm Dennis Bernstein with Miguel Gabila Molina. Today on the show, celebrated poet in Mission District icon Alejandro Mugia. Mugia is the founding member and the first director of the Mission Cultural Center. Did you know that? He is the founder of the Roque d'Anton Cultural Brigade and co-editor of Volcan poetry from Central America. We're going to talk about poetry and revolution, and he's reading with a bunch of incredibly powerful writers. You don't want to miss it this week here in the Bay Area where we come to you from. And also we're going to talk about... a bunch of, well, we're going to replay our amazingly, take the top of your head off interview with the attorney Huayda Araf, Palestinian-American attorney who represents those folks who try and bring life and death important food and medical care to the Gaza Strip. under a genocide now. We decided we would replay it and we hope that you can listen. If you didn't hear it last night, incredibly important interview. If you heard it last night, listen again because we want you to understand what is going on in our name, a genocide. Stay with us.

Hey, and you're listening to FlashPoint on Pacific Radio. My name is Dennis Bernstein. I'm joined here by Miguel Gavalon Molina. And if all goes well with technology, Alejandro Muilla joins us via telephone or some version of that. Alejandro, are you with us? I'm sending you smoke signal. Incredible. I see them. They're getting into my eyes. Hey, you're blinding me. What are you doing? No, appreciate it. And really, we're happy to have you. And this is sort of a luxury for us, but in a way it's crucial. I mean, tell us what a poet's job is in a time like this, a time of war, and incredible suffering. Is there a special place for the poet? I think the poet is in the very center of this turmoil, of this hurricane that's going on for many reasons. And I'm reminded right now about Bertil Brecht, how in times of darkness, we also need songs about the darkness. We also need songs about the darkness. about the times that we're living in and try to put through poetry a little bit of common sense into the chaos, right? To try and give a voice to an alternative to what's going on, not just in our society here in the United States. But more and more, the chaos, the suffering, the intolerance, the wars, the violence is spreading around the world. So I think more and more, the poetic voice, the voice of the poets, offers an alternative and needs to be heard in the times that we're living in. And it's sort of the poet tends to start in the heart. You know, we talk a lot about information, and we share information here at KPFA and Flashpoint Pacific Radio. And we often think of that as the news department, and they do news, and it's crucial alternative news. But information comes many ways, doesn't it? and poetry brings in a bit of a deeper way and it starts in the heart. I think part of what poetry does is condense everything that is going on, both the headlines, the current events, and I don't want to overuse the word chaos. but the destruction of the planet, for example, the environmental destruction of the planet, not just to mention the wars that are going on because all those munitions that are being fired throughout the world, whether it's Sudan, Yemen, Gaza, the West Bank, Ukraine are also very polluting instruments.

of chaos and destruction. So absolutely, I think more and more, what will save this planet, perhaps in a very altruistic point of view, being a poet myself or being accused of being a poet, is poetry, is art, is extending ourselves to the other, which the other tends to be the people that are waging war. the people that are opposite of us in many ways. And those are the ones that somehow we need to reach and make them understand that we all share a very common humanity, and we all share the planet equally. So we must all defend both the planet in our own sense of humanity. And poetry, I think, is an excellent way to start. Well, that is the voice of Alejandro Mugia. He is going to be reading tomorrow evening in the Bay Area for those of you who are listening from the Bay Area. He's going to be with Jenny Lim, with Kim Shuck, and with Josiah Luis Alderate. And I think this is going to be a moving moment in the middle of all these wars. I think it's important to have this kind of sacred sharing and sort of coming at all the issues at a bit of a different level. Joining us is our own Miguel Gavala Malina, Gavilan. Say hello to our sort of celebrated poet and guest today. Sure that, absolutely. Bienbenito, Alejandro, it's always good to have you, you know, on the show and yourself and others or myself and in my collectiva, my circle, are in gratitude to the poets like yourself, Alejandro, Dennis, and others. Because you see the world, through the view that you see, you're able to capture the essence of the human spirit, whether it's, you know, on the good of light or whether it's in the darkest of night. You're able to capture that. And the words, it's almost sometimes... prophetic and myself in coming into the madness of what we thought you know find today is you know contemporary the contemporary world and a society we're in that's under attack in the planet the society the entire planet is in a state of you know massive crisis and chaos which is a lot of it intentional but poets for myself have always been the greatest teachers You know, the true teachers are the poets who give us words that inspire us, that give us clarity. But most important, like you said, Dennis, touches the heart, the heart of what it is to be human, what it is to be alive, what it is to see hope, what it is to see the light. So that said, in these times, which are in some ways...

you know, dark times, darker than we've seen in our lifetime. Yes, we survived the Vietnam War, the Korean War, World War II, World War I. But this time it's different because the war is just not raging, you know, for the control and power of energy, but also the war is against the planet. And that said, Alejandro. What can people do that see the message, hear the message, you know, from, again, the grand maestro, the great masters of the word, teachers like yourself? What hope is there for the masses of people that see the light and understand that there is a crisis, the crisis? Well, I think one of the first important things about this is not to be a defeatist, meaning that everything is so bad that we may as well give up. No, we have to take, I think, the opposite approach that because we are in a crisis, it is also a time for opportunity, also a time to establish something new. something different, something progressive, something that respects the planet. And all we're talking about is respecting the planet, not necessarily, you know, doing organic foods or anything. Just having... a simple respect for the world, which is our house, the earth that we live in. It's like in your house, are you going to have garbage all over your house, inside your house? Are you going to pollute the house where you live in? Are you going to build fires to smoke yourself out of the house that you live in? So that's metaphoric, right? Our personal house... is our house where we live, but our collective house is the planet called Earth. And so we also have to protect our collective house, the roof that shelters all of us, whether we're in Asia or Africa or the Middle East or Latin America or the Galapagos or Hawaii or Japan. It's still the same house. And we have to kind of develop a more international, perspective about this and not worry so much about the borders that separate us, that isolate us. Oh, or if you're from Ecuador, what happens in the Amazon is irrelevant. Or if you're from Egypt, what happens in Asia is irrelevant. No, no, no. It's all the same house that just has different rooms. But still the same house. And we have to protect that house, as I've said before, I hope I'm not repeating. It's called Earth. It's called Mother Earth. It's called Mother Nature, Pacha Mama. And that's what I think part of our big focus has to be because it doesn't matter whether Democrats or Republicans win the coming election. If the planet is going up in flames.

So we have to look at a broader, more international picture, I think. That's a good point that going up in flames. They made this point. I think the other night, my late colleague, the great newsperson, Robert Knight, talked to this incredible research around what happened, what happened to the ozone layer above Iraq after all of our wars there? and what's happening, you know, what the military, what the war machine is doing to the air we breathe and everything about the way we live. Let me again tell people, we are honored with the presence of Alejandro Mugia. He is going to be reading tomorrow night with a distinguished crew, including Kim Schock and Jenny Lim, Jose Luis Al-Darate. And we would like to ask you to read a poem or two. I know you're on a phone. It's not perfect sound, but I think the words will come through and come true. And we want to make sure we expose some of our folks to some poetry. You're not going to get through listening to this program without hearing some poems. Okay, well, thank you for that, Dennis. I also want to, besides the reading tomorrow night at Art Lab at 67 Third Street, San Francisco, 5.30 a.m. tomorrow with Kim Shirk, former Poet Laureate, Jenny Lynn, Current, Foreign Laureate, Jose. 5.30 p.m. right? You said, hi. Yes. Yeah. And I believe the event is free. I also want to point out that there's an incredible exhibit going on in Action Latina on 24th Street, Friday night, Otra Onda, an incredible exhibit of historic and contemporary photographs of the Mission District. that everybody should absolutely see and admired featuring people like Lou Demete, Joe Ramos, and a lot of other great photographers. Stunning exhibit Friday night, 530 at Auxiana on 24th Street. Yes, I have to do that because I'm so impressed by that exhibit. Anyway, let me read your poem then, Dennis. This is actually a poem that I wrote maybe 20-some years ago, and it reflects on the so-called immigration situation that we're facing here in our society. But immigration is human nature. We have always moved since we walked out of Africa. We have not stopped walking as human beings. And the trails that we have carved in the Americas, north-south, south, north, are eternal and forever. And at the same time, what it's going on right now is the travesty and a distortion of that movement.

And so this poem highlights an event that happened in Texas 25 years ago where refugees traveling in a box car met a tragic death. Yes. 19 men. 19 men slipping through the border. 19 men hiding in a railroad yard. 19 men trying to get a tough job. 19 men heard a coyotes how 19 men with nothing to lose stepped into a Missouri Pacific aluminum freight car. And the doors were sealed shut. 19 men, going for a hard ride. 19 men, riding through El Paso. 19 men, sweating in the West, Texas heat. 19 men. And they won't get far without air debris. Where's the light in this rolling coffin? Let's strike a match. Let's see your faces. There's the Lindio Jacinto and Isidro and his compader Jorge and Los Quatitos, Mingo and Moncho, from Awas Caliente, who haven't eaten all day. And there's Adrian the redhead in Carlos, Elvanil, and El Zarco, Tomas, and Francisco, who just got married. Pablo, who's never been kissed, and the other Pablo too. And Paul Gerardo and Felipe, with his lapis of his student, David, who dreamt of his house with his son, David, Jr., barely 15. Quincho, the Nicoya, Memo, the poet, and Mario, who said, This was his last time in you, Miguel Rodriguez. 19 men riding in the death train. 19 men fighting off a bad dream. 19 men without air or water. 19 men. Who will hear their screams crazy with heat convulsions? 19 men tore their hair, ripped their skin, smeared their blood on the refrigerated nightmare. 19 men. Only one survived. 19 men.

All right. One survived, huh? That's often how it goes. One person makes it through to tell what happened, and that's how we know, bearing witness, right? Yeah. Like you, the poet. bearing witness for the witness, giving a microphone, if you will, giving over history over time, making sure that at least helping us to remember. We have to remember. That's what I love about poetry too. Speak to us, please. The role of the poet is to recover, to tell the story the way it was. My poetry teacher, the late and great, Amuryo Rook Kaiser, I think she wrote, what would happen if one woman told the truth about her life, the world would split open? It's a lot, right? It's beautiful. You have another one for us? We have a little time. Okay. Part of course of what's happening here in San Francisco is the whole upside down world that's been happening with the gentrification and now the AI influence, turning things upside down and creating a little bit of havoc as they kind of vacuum the wealth of this country into the data centers. Yeah? So it seems to me that... Data centers, yeah? I'm living in Silicon City.

We've got four minutes. I don't, I'm sorry to rush you, but I'd love to tell you to get the poem in. I'll do it in less than. Oh, we've got two minutes. Okay, I'll do it in a minute and a half. Okay, go. They evicted Mia from her storefront on Valencia. Then they burned down the apartment on 22nd Street. The good die young. Isn't it a pity? But the beat goes on in Silicon City. You're a stranger now in your hometown with strange faces on one's familiar street and shadows and cops. Strangers on a strange B. The nights are mostly pretty, but hey, okay, you're living in one city. Thank you.

Thank you. Thank you for the poetry. People can check you out tomorrow night, Common Ground Wednesdays, along with Jenny Lynn, Kim Shuck, Josiah Luis Alderate. Our guest tonight is Alejandro Mugia, and we appreciate the poetry of the time, the information, please. By the way, the address for that reading tomorrow, 67 Turk Street, San Francisco. 530 to 830 you're listening to flashpoints on pacifical radio and we now want to rebroadcast in a mighty powerful interview we did with hoaida or ral about among other things the way in which The Israelis are practicing genocide on people who are trying to bring medical care and food to the same people that they're starving. That is, the Israelis are starving and genociding. Listen to this. There is an ongoing expanding genocide in Gaza, and it just continues and continues. The suffering is immense and the reporting is almost nonexistent in the corporate mainstream. Huerta Aranth joins us. She has worked with many organizations in terms of Palestinian action, liberation, working with taxpayers against genocide, National Lawyers Guild, International Committee, and a whole lot more. Welcome Huweta back to flashpoints. It is good to have you with us. I'm glad to have you because I know that you... have a full understanding of the entirety, the full breadth of the suffering, and we want to make sure we keep people apprised that there is, in fact, a genocide in motion, and it's being paid for in large part by U.S. tax dollars. That wouldn't be an exaggeration, would it? First of all, thank you for having me, Dennis. It's always an honor to be with you, and I really appreciate the work, and especially what you said now is so critical that there's an ongoing genocide. And no, it would not be an exaggeration at all to say that this genocide is enabled. It's being committed in lockstep with the United States. Without the United States, Israel would not be able to carry it out. And that... It was actually the premise of a complaint that taxpayers against genocide that you mentioned lodged a complaint at the Inter-American Commission for Human Rights. I represented them, continue to represent them as a lead attorney on that case, representing taxpayers against genocide and Palestinian Americans who are taxpayers who pay their taxes that then...

go to murder their families in Gaza and destroy their property and violate all kinds of human rights, which goes against the United States' responsibility. We can, if there's time, we can talk a little bit more about that. But what you said that's so critical is that the genocide is ongoing. We don't see a lot of coverage of Gaza. Some people believe that there's a ceasefire now. And because there aren't hundreds of bombs raining down every day, people think that it is a little bit easier, a little bit. The genocide has ended. And that is so far from the truth and that. continues to aid Israel's plan to continue annihilating the Palestinian people. And while I don't really like to speak in statistics, but just to give your listeners an idea, the supposed ceasefire was agreed to on October 10th, right, of 2025. Since then, Israel has killed nearly 1,300 Palestinians. Every day, there's been killing about 300 of them. children either through blowing them to pieces burning them to death children have been sniped in the head and in the heart during what is supposed to be a ceasefire you have not heard of any Palestinian military activities, Palestinians fighting back, Palestinians even threatening, you know, as Israel says its security, and yet Israel has continued to kill Palestinians on a daily basis and continue to deny Palestinians and necessities of life, including food and humanitarian aid as part of the... ceasefire agreement that israel committed to they are supposed to allow 600 trucks of humanitarian aid into gaza every day which is the bare minimum of the bare minimum that people need to survive and israel has not on any day come close to even meeting half of that on average maybe they're allowing 150 uh trucks in and sometimes none at all And it's not the thing that people don't also recognize this is or understand because it's not reported as how insidious this is that they may be allowing. 100 150 trucks in but these aren't from humanitarian aid organizations that can distribute them to people who need them they'll allow in trucks full of commercial goods and food that will go into the markets so you'll see that there is food in the markets but people are devastated and doesn't

hardly anybody is working people don't have money to buy this so you've created this black market while the humanitarian aid that's sitting in trucks these organizations is not getting in and so people continue to really struggle every day to survive to find food to find water it really is a catastrophe but an engineered man-made deliberate humanitarian catastrophe a deliberate catastrophe. And I want to just... talk a little bit more about what you're describing here because it is a near panic and people are desperate because they're barely getting by something goes wrong and people simply are going to die in larger and larger numbers I Could you say something about, what about health care? How are people, they're being bombed every day. People are being wounded and murdered, we have to say, every day. Has the health care system holding up? health care system has been all but decimated. I mean, you have a less than half of Gaza's hospitals that are functioning. And it's really hard to explain how Palestinian medics continue to try to serve with very little equipment and medicines that are being allowed in and then themselves being under attack. So the Palestinian health care community has been targeted. For a while, Israel was allowing in a limited number of foreign medics to come assist Palestinians. And repeatedly, you'd hear from these, including American doctors, about how heroic really these Palestinian medical professionals are and the conditions that they are working underneath with almost nothing. Sometimes they don't even have gauze. to work with and even though their structures and their ambulances and their colleagues have been bombed they continue to try to make do because there really is no other option they're trying to survive a genocide so it is very poor and a lot of people are dying from preventable conditions from infections if you can imagine Approximately 90% of Palestinian housing buildings has been destroyed in this genocide. Even post the so-called ceasefire, Israel was taking bulldozers and raising entire neighborhoods. You said 90%. Approximately 90%. It's hard, it's really hard to imagine. It's unbelievable. Yes, but it's true. I know.

And so you have people who may have injured, let's say, but there isn't room in the hospitals to continue to keep people. And if you've seen images from Gaza, you have people on the floors getting treated or attempted to get treated. So if someone would have a... you know, have a procedure done, including an amputation. And then they're sent home because you can't keep them. There are so many. There's so much need, there's so much injury. So you send them home, but they don't have a home to go to. So they're in these tents. You don't have water. You don't have sanitation. You have something else that's not reported on. You have mass infestations of rats, of... a vermin that stories of parents that are staying up all night to try to keep the rats from biting their children in these tents but so there is no sanitation and so people are getting infected their wounds that they should be able to heal from are getting infected and people are dying there are The last I checked close to 20,000 Palestinians also that need immediate evacuation because they don't have the ability to treat them in Gaza. And Israel's not letting them out. They were supposed to allow out, according to the ceasefire agreement, 50 Palestinians a day for medical treatment, which is almost nothing when you consider the need. But they're not even meeting that. And so many Palestinians are continued to suffer, are unfortunately dying from diseases or conditions and infections that could be treated if supplies were able to come in or if they were allowed to be evacuated to be treated abroad. Wow. You're listening to FlashPoint on Pacific Radio. We're speaking with Huerta Ralph. She works with taxpayers against genocide. Let me ask you, Huweda, about the... We've done a lot of reporting on the boats, trying to bring aid, alternative routes, to get necessary aid in this life and death situation that you've been describing. uh for us what kind of are they still are these boats still under attack are they still being undermined uh are they still being are the people on the boat still being arrested and brutalized oh absolutely dennis it's you may know i was on my first boat to try to break the seat of gaza in 2008 and since then You know, the movement has grown. People have, especially in the last year, people have come to see frustrated by this genocide and the fact that our government is failing. It has not only failed for nearly two decades to end a brutal and illegal siege on Gaza, but even during a genocide that everyone could witness on their screens, failed to intervene and continue.

The international community continues to allow Israel, which has been credibly accused by all major human rights organizations and scholars and the International Association of Genocide Scholars and is before the International Court of Justice for genocide and its leaders are wanted by the International Criminal Court and yet. Israel is allowed to control what medicines, what aid, what anything gets into a people that they are actively exterminating. It is an unbelievable, unacceptable state of affairs. And so the... Freedom Flotilla Coalition believes that it is our duty to continue to sail, to try to break this illegal siege of Gaza, not simply to bring in humanitarian aid because, yes, aid is needed, but our votes, our simple votes are not going to do it. It is not going to meet the humanitarian aid need. And also Palestinians continue to tell us, We don't want to live on aid. We want our freedom. And so from the very first time we sailed until the last mission that went, we are carrying what we can, but we're also saying it's our duty to act to break this criminal. illegal siege, Palestinians deserve freedom, and we cannot allow Israel to continue to decimate Palestinian lives like this. It is precisely because there has been no accountability for the decades that Israel has been persecuting Palestinians, that Israel has felt completely at ease to carry out a live stream genocide and to continue. And so the last time we sailed with a couple of different... It wasn't, for many, many years, it was only the Freedom Plotilla coalition organizing. But in this last year, we've had other organizations come on board, the Global Samud Flotilla. We had dozens and dozens of boats sail. And Israel attacked these boats twice within the period of a month, the first time. attacked these boats and kidnapped international civilians on the doorstep of Europe. The boats were not even headed to Gaza yet. They were off the coast. of Greece and yet Israel attacked them, kidnapped and brutalized these internationals with impunity. They think they can attack anyone anywhere. The entire Mediterranean is theirs to pirate is the message that they were sending. And Europe has said and done nothing about it. And so just a few weeks later, when 50 boats launched carrying 430 civilians,

25 U.S. citizens on these ships. Israel again attacked them one by one. It kidnapped all of the civilians. It transferred them onto what we have called torture ships because it brutalized, it tortured these international civilians, including 25 Americans, some of the... injuries that these volunteers sustained were burn marks all over their bodies from being tasered collapsed lungs broken ribs at least a dozen of them report sexual abuse it was absolutely horrific and this is Some of your listeners may have seen, you know, the Israeli national security minister, It's Amar bin Vier boasting and tormenting these international volunteers while they were in stressed positions, again, because it's this total feeling that they could do anything they want with impunity because our governments have not sanctioned them, have not held them accountable. Now, a few governments after announced that they were sanctioning Ittimore Itamar Ben-Gvir, this individual that posted these videos. of himself tormenting these international volunteers. But it is so important to stress that it is not one person. It's not Ben Viet. It's not Benjamin Netanyahu. It is an entire settler colonial apartheid project that has been working to ethnically cleanse to get rid of Palestinians. for eight decades with near total impunity and that is what has to be stopped so as far as the freedom of flotilla coalition and the flotilla in general we will continue and you will hear very very soon about a new mission that is going to try to break the siege of And of course we want to reach Gaza, but what these missions do is continue to pressure our own governments to act because our governments do have a responsibility under international law to the Palestinians, which they have failed. But they also have domestic responsibilities to their own civilians, which they are failing and civilians more in Europe than here because our laws are terrible, but are trying to hold their governments accountable for what they're not doing to uphold their... rights and the rights of the Palestinian people under international law. We're speaking with Huwaita Arraf. Huweda, I want to ask you before we, one more area that I want to explore with you. And that is what is going on in the West Bank. A lot of people don't understand the geography of Gaza and the West Bank. The West Bank is probably eight or ten times the size. of Gaza, there is expanding violence and collaborations between the Israeli military and the so-called settlers movement. Could you talk about that, the dangers and what's sort of happening on the ground there? Because it's pretty violent and it's getting worse.

It is very violent. It is the worst that I can remember. I just heard some activists actually from the West Bank saying a Palestinian activist that it is the worst that they've seen in their entire lifetime. Settlers are... I mean, they've always acted with impunity, but they feel even more emboldened. And it is settler with the complete cooperation of the Israeli military. So they are attacking Palestinian communities, towns and villages. They are burning their field. They are burnings. They are hospitalizing Palestinians because they descend. They are pogroms. They descend on these villages with bats. with guns, with chains, with four by fours, or two by fours, and the military, the Israeli military is either watching. and protecting the settlers or they're actively participating. And if Palestinians try to defend themselves in any way, the soldiers, the Israeli military comes and arrests the Palestinians. And this is happening on a daily basis. On average, it's about a half a dozen to a dozen attacks. daily throughout the occupied West Bank. And even the soldiers, the settlers have become involved in that they are also carrying out these sexual assaults on these Palestinian communities. And again, Palestinians. If they fight back, they are the ones who are targeted, who are arrested, and we didn't even speak about the situation inside the Israeli prisons, how what the Israeli state is doing to these Palestinian hostages, 10,000. Talk about that. And doctors, and everybody has been subjected to torture if they act outside what the Israelis are willing to accept. Oh, absolutely. And before I do that, I just want to say we are calling on people who can to consider going to the occupied Palestinian territory because there is active ethnic cleansing, violent ethnic cleansing being carried out right now. And one of the things that is helping to... save it off a little bit, not completely, but having international witnesses there. And as you mentioned, I have long been involved with the international solidarity movement that provides a solidarity presence, international volunteers that go and stay with Palestinian communities and document. And their presence alone sometimes can serve as a deterrent. And so if people can look up the international solidarity movement and see if you can spend some time volunteering, there's also

another organization called Fezah, working with the International Solidarity Movement. They are together trying to plan a significant international presence for the olive harvest, which is coming up in the fall. But even if you can go now, you'd be welcome in the olive harvest. We'd like to have a lot of people there because olive harvesting is one of Palestinians. main source of livelihood these days and the settlers and soldiers try to prevent Palestinians from harvesting their olives or actively attack them and having an international presence of conserved as a deterrent or if not an active deterrent at least a witness and we need witnesses we need more people telling the story Now briefly, I know we don't have a lot of time left, but yes, we have medical doctors who have been kidnapped from Gaza, who are languishing in Israeli jails, one of the most well-known Dr. Hussam Abu Safia. There's a large international campaign to try to secure his release because the last time... His attorney was able to see him, Dr. Abu Safia, had visible torture marks on his body. He did tell his lawyer, this is the last time you will see me. They're going to kill me. And this man is a hero, and yet he is being held and tortured by Israel. He was kidnapped from his hospital in northern Gaza. He was the director of the Kamal-Adwan Hospital. Say more about his history. The idea that this man is being tortured to death as we speak, it's important for people to understand the extraordinary nature of this humanitarian medical visionary in one of the most difficult areas in the world. Yes, absolutely. He was the director of the Kamal-Adwan Hospital in northern Gaza, and this hospital came under bombardment repeatedly. In fact, Dr. Abu Safia's own son was killed, and he had to bury him in the hospital grounds because they couldn't leave. But he continued to serve his patients. And Israel... They tried to get them to evacuate the hospital. He said, I can't leave and I'm not leaving my patients. You can't evacuate an entire hospital of people who are injured. He himself is a pediatrician. And in December 2024, Israel. called him out of the hospital under threat of bombing the entire hospital so he steps out and there's an iconic picture him walking towards all destruction all over the place walking towards an Israeli tank and they took him from there and for almost a year

nobody heard from him what was happening to him it was only earlier this year that he was seen for the first time and then he was seen once again just last month as I said and his attorney is reporting that he had visible abuse torture marks on his body and Dr. Abu Savilla himself said, you won't see me again. They brought me here to kill me. And he is only one of 10,000. And of course, not all 10,000 are medics, but there are other medics also still being held that have been kidnapped from Gaza. We actually don't know how many, Dennis, because there are people missing from Gaza and their families don't know if they were taken by Israel, if they are buried under the rubble if they have been killed if they are in prison their families don't know there are still approximately 10 000 Palestinians buried under the rubble that is Gaza Israel has not allowed in excavators the only time they allowed in excavators is when they were looking for israeli possible Israeli hostages but they won't let Palestinians have digging machines so they can also find their loved ones and so you have many families in Gaza that actually don't know what happened to their loved ones we know that of the 10,000 Palestinians that are held in these Israeli dungeons, nearly 4,000 of them have not been charged with anything, have never had their day in court, may not even know why they're being held, including Dr. Abu Sofia. He has not been charged with anything. He has been held for a year and a half with no charges, no charges whatsoever. And this includes children, about 300. children are also subjected to this military regime where Palestinians have no rights. And then what's happening to them, who is responsible for the Israeli prison system is the same man that was taking pleasure in publicizing his tormenting of the international civilians. This is the Israeli Minister of National Security, Itamar Ben-Gvir. And he has been starving Palestinian detainees in giving them barely enough food to survive. So if you see anyone who's been released, they've sometimes lost a third of their weight in addition to the various forms of physical and sexual abuse. that has been carried out against him. There are some reports on there. Things that I can't even repeat here, but we have the Palestinian feminist collective, a group that I am a part of, recently released a report about this. The Francesca Albanese, the UN Special Reporteur on Human Rights and the occupied Palestinian territories released a report about this. And also Amnesty International Human Rights Watch, even the Israeli Human Rights Organization. and they all have reports talking about the horrific things, unspeakable things that are done to Palestinian detainees.

Well, you are listening to FlashPoint on Pacifica Radio. We are speaking with Hoyd-Rov. She's worked with taxpayers against genocide, worked with many organizations. And I guess we're running out of time, but give us your best... sense of where this is going if something doesn't change. We see there's still not a lot of sympathy for Palestinians in the United States. There's a, you know, we can see the sort of the conservative Democratic Party talking about sort of these dangerous brown people in who are now the mayor of new york and you know big high offices in michigan uh and it's almost as if you are not there's either full um capitulation full silence on this that you've been talking about this this genocide or uh people are attacked for even bringing it up and uh sort of folks like me and you were you know accused of making it up yeah um You're right in that there is not enough focus and there is not enough of concern and involvement in action in order to stop what's happening because we are looking at and we are. faced with a genocide that is being committed on our watch and nobody can say they didn't know about it. And especially as US citizens, people who pay taxes, people whose elected representatives are making the decision to continue funding this genocide. We are complicit. And so it's what do we say about ourselves, what we did and what we didn't do as these horrific crimes were being committed. That is really sobering and devastating. when you think about it it's coming upon three years where we have been seeing emaciated starved infants and babies decapitated and disemboweled children a family's being burned to death every single day uh today marks the one year anniversary of the killing of a palestinian journalist n s sharif and he is one of over 250 Palestinian journalists who have been killed and targeted, targeted for trying to document their own genocide. And so the statistics are staggering and knowing that this is being committed on our watch and with our funding and enabled by our elected representatives, it should put more of an emphasis on.

on people, on Palestinians, sorry, on U.S. citizens to care and to do more. I am a little bit more optimistic, not what's happening on the international scene because we just heard today that Benjamin Netanyahu rejected the Trump's 15-point plan because he is interested in his right-wing government in order to appease. Imagine. Imagine. He needs more war and more violence and more killing in order to get votes in Israel. This is where Israeli society has come. And that 15-point plan is so far from even meeting the bare minimum when it comes to the rights of the Palestinian people. But let's say maybe it would have moved things a little bit forward. Benjamin Netanyahu just announced today that he's rejecting it. Any kind of relief does not look like it's on the horizon. But when it comes to the U.S. political scene, we have seen a massive shift. So now you have reportedly 80% of Democratic voters or the Democratic base that is opposed to continued funding of Israel. People are Americans. across all parties are sympathizing more with Palestinians, don't want to see more of U.S. weapons go to fund Israel. And as you mentioned in Michigan, we just had our elections, our primaries last week, and we saw Dr. Abdul El-Sayed. As you said, a brown Muslim man and all of the racist tropes and the fear-mongering was used against him and over $70 million of outside money. Half of it from A-PAC or Israel Line group spent against him. And yet he still eked out a win. He still had such. And so I would have liked to see him win by a larger margin. But when you consider the massive amount of money spent against him, he was outside. spent about 10 to 1 and still one. This is indicative of something. And if you hear some of the, you know, establishment Democrats or some pundits, they'll talk about an insurgency in the party. But it is where the base has been for a long time on things that we're demanding. And a lot of us are saying you can't be progressive except for Palestine anymore. And so Palestine and the corruptive role of APAC and the millions that they have been paying in to buy our elections and our politicians were a central focus of this race. And races across the country. So that change, I think we don't want to underplay that. Is that going to result in saving any Palestinian lives anytime? soon no but I think we need to continue to make it we need to make it make sure it continues to play an important role in the November elections coming up and also as we go into 2028 for the presidential elections

Hoita Ralph, we really thank you for taking the time out and for sharing very important information that's hard to get out into the mainstream and your wealth of the kinds of things we need to understand to deal with this issue in a fair way that makes sense. Thanks for taking the time out again and I hope you'll keep keeping us posted on what's happening on the ground. Thank you. You know, I will be in the Bay Area next week. Oh, yeah, tell us about that. Please. Coming weekend, I will be in the Bay Area. Yes, I am. I'm excited to come out to the Bay Area on the, on Saturday, Sunday, and Monday. There will be events. It's sponsored by local organizations and friends of Sabil, North America. Sabil is a Palestinian Christian. ecumenical organization believing in and promoting liberation theology on saturday i will at from three to five at the united methodist church in santa rosa on sunday uh i believe also from three to five at the um plymouth united church of christ in oakland and on monday at seven p m in let me tell you where Oh, at the West Hope Presbyterian Church. Yes, on Monday, August 17th, West Hope. Yes, in Saratoga. This, I think Fawzna, Friends of Sabine, North America will have a complete itinerary on their list. But I look forward to joining you out there and having good discussions and hopefully some mobilizations taking place. Well, we look forward to seeing you. And again, if anybody missed any of those details, is there an address? They can check out and follow up and get any information they might need. Is there a good email for me? Yes. Please look up FOSNA, which is Friends of Sabine, North America, F-O-S-N-A dot org, and backslash my name, and you'll get this, you can register, you'll get the full schedule, so F-O-S-N-A dot org, back-slash H-U-W-A-I-D-A.A. FOSNA.org slash H-U-W-A-I-D-A, and you should get the full schedule. Thank you for taking the time and I hope I get to see you when you come out west. All right, you take it easy now. And that does it for another episode of Flash Points. Our executive producer is Dennis Bernstein. Senior producers Miguel Gavallon Malina and Kevin Pina. Technical producer Rod Akil, our theme music written and produced by Charlie Lang. For questions and comments, email Dennis Bernstein at Dennis at kpFA.org. Thank you for listening.

I am Susan Young, chair of the Pacifica Foundation Board of Directors. One of the things that makes Pacifica so special is that we are community-supported radio. That means our stations exist to serve our communities, not corporate owners or outside interests. For more than 75 years, we've created space for thoughtful conversations, independent journalism, diverse voices, and local programming that reflects the people we serve. Each station crafts its own mix of music, public affairs, arts, and journalism. Community Radio gives all of us a place to learn from one another, and I'm proud to be a part of this tradition. 94.1, KPFA. 89.3, KPFB in Berkeley. 88.1, KF, CF, and Fresno, and online at KPFA.org.