BONUS: From woke to MAGA to A.I.: Erykah Badu’s entire Ari Melber interview

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Welcome to Mavericks with Ari Melbert. Today we are joined by a celebrated singer, DJ, and really cultural icon, four-time Grammy winner, Erica Badu. Thanks for being here. Thanks for having me. I'm excited. Is there any energy or intention which is set for our conversation? I think we are in alignment. We're surrounded by... everything that matters. As long as we're getting this oxygen, I think we're good. Good. Oxygen's good. Yeah, I like being outside. Usually they have us inside. For you, we're outside. Thank you. You got a lot going on that we're going to get into. Yeah. But just big picture. How are you feeling at this point in your life and your art and all this other business you're doing? I feel exquisite. I feel excited, you know. Yeah. Exquisite's good. Looking forward to the possibilities of things. Do you feel like you're building off everything and I got some stuff I'm going to show you? Okay. It's all future. You got everything ahead of you. I think I got everything ahead of me. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I like that. So we talk to people who we call Mavericks. Okay. Labels can get in the way. We could call them anything. Perfect. But. You from the start that we got to meet you, at least in society, in the culture, really saw this independent spirit. Yeah. So we kind of want to start from there and look at that. My name is Erica Badu, also known as Badula Oblingata.

How did you work out being you? Work out being me. Yeah. How'd you figure out how to be you? Hmm. I don't think I have too many choices. I follow my heart. Sometimes I'm afraid and nervous, but I'm confident. So it makes me brave. My thoughts are unorthodox a lot. I do not have the most popular opinion, as I've learned over the years. But the only thing I can be is me. And as a mutable person, I've learned to be the best me, but still be able to mutate within different circles so that I don't disrupt it too much. Yeah. It's funny you say that some of the opinions may be unpopular. Yeah. Popularity changes over time. Yeah. Your work was very popular from the jump. Yeah. Baduism, triple platinum, and kind of immediately this excitement. Yeah. One question I've been curious about now I get to meet you is, did that embrace, which really only endured over time? Uh-huh. Did that make it harder or easier to do your next work? How did that affect your approach? It didn't affect my approach. It affects the people around you and their opinions and what they think. And if you're not careful, that will influence you or deter you from doing what you want. So I was very careful. I took my time because I don't feel it's a race. My best work is still in me. So I just pace myself. Well, you know why life ain't a race. Why? Because then we'd be trying to die first. That's right. That's how you know. That don't make no sense. They lie. Somebody lying. I always find that funny. They say, oh, someone did this by this age. And you're sort of like, so? Right. Because if it's something worth doing, then you do it when you get to it. Hopefully. Yeah. But the racing of it means, okay, now you did it by that age. So what? You kind of get to it when you become it. Because I'm finding out that the universe really doesn't give you. what you ask for, it gives you what you are. And you attract the things that you are. So, yeah, you can't really race to be something you're not. Do you remember how old you were when you had that thought or that, was that always with you? It was always with me, but not in those words. Yeah. Yeah. I always felt it. So let's look at Erica Badu around that early time. Uh-huh. On Regis and Kathy Lee. Oh. And Baduism. Is there, can you define that for us? The Baduism experience is supposed to get you high and make you feel really good naturally. I just have one big question about your career now. Sure. You have one of the most extraordinarily beautiful faces. Why in the world would you hide your face on the cover of this? You really are exquisitely beautiful. Well, thanks. I don't know, I just don't think it's really all about Erica Badu. It's about the way that you're supposed to feel when you hear the music. It took a lot of people and a lot of energy from the creator to bring this all together. How do you feel looking at her, looking at you? She's so agreeing. I think she's very special, very gifted and very, very talented, very giving.

Very naive. How do you see her as naive? She just didn't know a lot of things, you know, and was influenced easily, you know, by other people's feelings and thoughts. So I had to be really careful, like I just said, to pace myself so that I wouldn't, you know, go down the wrong, if there's a wrong path. Yeah. Well, we got another. We'll see if you remember this. Okay. I want to be another example of... What positivity can bring. I'm an artist. The creator has blessed me in every aspect of the word. I'm a dancer, singer, a singer, actress, poetist, anything that has to do with art. You know, I live, art, dress art. I guess you could say art is my religion. And to use my gifts is my gift back to the creators. Same person? I still feel like that. And I mean, it's interesting looking at that because if I got like a little snatch, I could look like that again. You know that, right? I know that, yeah. I mean, I don't even think you need an adjustment. It's you. I'm good. Yeah. So when you look at that and you see what you're doing now, you charted your own path. Yeah. Then in COVID, you stood up your own... concert streaming. Yeah. You've got this cannabis accessory line and now new you have your own cannabis with cookies. Yeah. So how does that work for you? Have you tried it? What are the results? I'm super excited about that. That's a long time coming. A friend Kamel gave me. the energy to do it, you know, and I waited for a little while. And when I was ready, I told Burner, I'm ready now because I wanted to do a little research because I wanted some purpose in the whole thing. Yeah, Burner's a sort of businessman and artist rapper who's involved. That's correct. Burner is the owner of the Cookies franchise. The, the... biggest growing franchise for legalized cannabis in the world right now. So, yeah, he's a perfect person to meet and be influenced by because he was a good teacher. He's a good friend. He was the plug. He gave me all of the information I needed. And I found my space, my place, my interest is women's studies in cannabis because I use it in my... May I work? What does purpose mean in this line? Purpose in this line for me is to continue that conversation about women's health in the cannabinoid world, to break some of the taboos and to start a new dialogue about what cannabis means in our world and in our bodies in our lives. I use cannabis a lot in my work as a doula. And as a doula, I help babies come into the world and I also sit at the bed, the rest bed where people pass on. And cannabis is a really big plant medicine that we use in there. And I serve it as tea a lot. So when I thought about the packaging for that by do with cookies, I thought about this.

Persian oriental look of porcelain and blue flowers. So the packaging looks like that. And I just collect things that look like that now. It's like my new thing. You know, I collect pieces, broken pieces of art. There's a story there, and there's beauty in it. And... We've all lived through this sort of shift in part of the war on drugs where you still got people in prisons for marijuana-related offenses, et cetera, while we're shifting out to actually... do some of this business, and it's all in flux. What does it mean to you to have people from communities that traditionally have been targeted and over-incarcerated as compared to, like, white users of the same drug back when it was more criminalized? Yeah, I mean, I think it should be legalized, and, you know, I don't like to give a lot of political opinions. I've learned my lesson with that. But what we do know is that there are a lot of people in jail who are very intelligent. alchemists who can change chemicals into other things and properties. I believe that legalizing marijuana would be one of the best things to happen for our community because we're not the people bringing it into the community in the first place. But we're taking the wrap for it. Yeah. In Texas, specifically, I would like to spearhead the campaign to legalize marijuana for many reasons. Yeah. One is the mass incarceration. The other reason is because I want, it's overshadow is overshadowed or the use of marijuana is overshadowed by the commercial use and the medicinal use of the herb is kind of being. you know, covered over by commercial use. Yeah. You said you learned your lesson on politics. Maybe we'll come back to that. But on hip hop, it's like you are so hip hop. You ought to. Respect. You're also this immaculate singer. People have made it. Look, people made all these comparisons. We can get to that. You had all these singers. But you did start as a rapper. You've worked with so many rappers. What does hip hop mean to your creativity right now? Um, hip hop is a culture. And in that culture, there is a process in which we do things. You know, first there's the music or the beat, and then the lyrics come afterwards. The other way around, it's poetry, if you're writing lyrics. So, uh, it's very braggadocious. It's very confident.

You know, and that's where I got a lot of my confidence from being an MC. Yeah. In that arena, it's okay to boast and brag and be a part-time narcissist, you know. So that gave me a lot of inspiration and confidence. Yeah. It's been said some don't need no part-time lover, but a part-time narcissist, maybe. Maybe. Maybe. Yeah, yeah. Do you remember your first bar? Yeah. It's... Well, my name is Apples in a rock your world. I'm also known as the Gucci girl. Well, I'm super cute and plenty bad 30, 26, 36 and a head. Hey, okay. Do you remember your first part? Who said I had a first bar? You got to have a bar and you somewhere already. In high school, I had this line. I only remember like a part of it where I, but I thought it was really great, but I was a kid. Okay. But it was like, I'm the one who's deaf, but you ain't even heard. Ooh. Yeah, I was really excited. That's a bar. If you say so. It is. So this is my question for you. Given that you do those different things, are they just distinct creative talents and you happen to have them? Which is great for you, right? Because you could DJ and you have this hip-hop party and then the singing voice everybody know. Yes. Or do you think they reinforce each other? Does being... one of those things help you be a better DJ, help you be a better singer? Probably, yeah, because they all go together in hip-hop. The culture of hip-pop is graffiti, it's breakdancing, you know these things, it's the spoken word, it's rap, it's, did I say DJing, it's the way we dress, it's a language that we have, it's a full culture, and hip-hop is the people. So hip-hop changes with the people. As we progress and change and grow, so does it. So I think it's all something, it's all in the same pot, you know, kind of. And being creative is the nucleus of that. You know, anybody can say they're a rapper or a dancer or something. But the creative... Part of it is what's special about it. You know, the more creative you are on a cipher, the better you are as a freestyler, or a DJ, or someone who could put a playlist together, or a graffiti artist. You know, the more creative you are, you know, in this thing, the further you'll go. Yeah. Yeah. It's funny, because in talking... Conversations, they start and they end. With most people, I mean, maybe your closest friends, it feels continuous. But with most people, that's talking, right? And humans do a lot of talking. Yeah, we talk. But we start and we end. It seems to be culture, the conversation's always ongoing. And I'm curious about that with you because you're in this conversation with hip-hop to this day. Yeah. Does that inform you and you say, oh, I want to be doing that or that's just sort of organic and it just keeps happening? Yeah, I'll answer it like this. I really appreciate artists that I can feel. It doesn't matter what they're talking about. They can be talking about shaking their ass, so they can be talking about saving the world or God or healthy or healing. But if I believe it...

That's when it's potent to me. And what hip-hop or music or art period is all about is the real girth in personal energy that you're sharing. You're almost supposed to feel like you're not supposed to be seeing it when you're watching someone when they're really honest about something. You know what I mean? Yeah, because, well, that's the thing. We love society. I think most people, even introverts. Yeah. don't want to be alone their whole lives. That's right. So we need society as human people, as social animals. Yeah. But what you just said is deep, right? When you see someone really bear their soul, you think, oh, that's so raw and true and private, it's almost like I shouldn't see it. And yet with art, it feels like art can connect us to our humanity more than just being out with people. Sure. You know? I agree with that. Let me play your interaction. We just have back and forth. Okay. We got... You covering a song people might know in the rap game. Okay. And then we got black rapper, artist, singer, covering you. Oh. You used to call me on myself. You'd love me. I remember that yet. Yeah.

Yeah. The world keeps turning. Yeah. Oh, what a day. Yeah. What a day, what a day. Yeah. How do you feel about that interaction? I love it. You know, I love that, you know. You don't like everybody doing your stuff. You know. Who should not do bad doing? I don't know yet. You know, I let you know. I don't know exactly who should not, but. I feel it. I appreciate Black's version of that. Yeah. Yeah, and Drake was cool with mine, so I was happy about that. A lot of younger artists, particularly like coming up now in this digital era, it is faster. It is more about the vibe, the energy, the mood. Yeah. Although there are still plenty of conscious artists and there's plenty of paragraphs you can find. Right. I read that you said, well, you love the Flintstones. Oh, yeah. But the pacing doesn't work for kids today. Uh-uh. So how do you deal with today's pacing? Because you seem really unthreatened by it. A lot of people go, oh, this is new. Why can't we just love my old? It's like, you seem really open to the new pace. You know what? I'm probably the opposite of that last statement you made. I appreciate being in a moment and growing with the time. You know, I think that's the key to reinvention and reinvention is the key to survival in this business. And... I'm able to, I don't know, they just made me like this, whoever they are. You know, they made me like this. I'm just really interested in what's next. You know, I'm a very futuristic thinking human, and I don't get stuck in the past. Once I do something, it doesn't belong to me anymore. So, yeah. I like that. It's like Snoop said. He can't watch his highlights at halftime. Nah. He's got to live. I'm curious about your aesthetic, image, visual, artistic sense. You mentioned earlier, hip hop has this, and other genres have it too, where we see. I mean, is there anything you can tell me about? what we're looking at right now, because it seems like a whole story, wherever you want to start with the- I slept in this. This is not nothing. These gold rings, these are my talismans and amulets and things. You know, these are things that just make me feel good. And they're all custom, the things that I wear from the hat to everything else. And what's the hat made out of? This hat is made out of resin, actually. For real. Oh, okay, yeah. So, because it looked to me almost like something that would be inside a cartoon or like soft. Yeah, it is. As a softness. Yeah, it's hard, though. It's made by a friend of my Bonne Capello. So in the jacket, Juano, a subsidiary of comb diggers song. That's one of my favorite designers, you know. So I mix and match things. These pants were given to me by one of the elders in my community because I just loved them because he wore him so much.

Yeah, I just mix and match things. You know, they're, like I said, talismans and amulists, things that make me feel good. Yeah. I love shape and color and things like that. Yeah, and that's like, so we saw you pop up on the cover of Vogue. I popped up. Popped up? Yeah, pulled up. Hey, Vogue. And also sort of showing that. This idea that you have to choose, that you would have to choose what they used to or sometimes still call streetwear versus couture high fashion. You seem to be like, nah, we could do it all together, yeah? Yeah. And then when we look at some of your work here. Yes. What does this mean to you, visually? This album cover, we're looking at New America Part 1, Fourth World War. And I wrote that album off of the heels of... watching a documentary called Fourth World War, which was about occupation all over the planet. Occupation is when the government comes in and takes some land for one reason or another that does not belong to them or to anyone. But it's land that indigenous people built and lived on. So in this piece of art done by a good friend of mine, Emick, whose father is from Israel. was a political cartoonist, his father. He became a rock poster artist. He does posters for the Grateful Dead, B.C. boys, different people. And I met Emick, and I talked to him about my album, New America, Part 1, because it was a social political kind of thing. And this is what he came up with. And... Inside of the Afro are so many different things. You know, there are signs of the time. Money, capitalism, needles. But then they're in her hair like it's like, are they part of her or they're in her mind? They're in my mind. Yeah. Because New America Part 1 was me standing on an apex or standing at the top of something, observing everything. There are no solutions in this album. It's just what I've observed. Well, I would push you on that. May I push you on that? You can push me. Thomas Dewey said, a problem well stated is a problem half solved. I understand that. Could be. But we did start a lot of stuff on there. There's a song on this particular album called Master Teacher. And in that song, Master Teacher, the chorus is I Stay Woke. So Stay Woke was introduced to the world. By way of this album, New America Part 1, and I tweeted it once. George and Ann Moldro actually wrote the song. She's singing with me. And I tweeted it about this group that was detained Pussy Riot. They're this group of activists who are artists. And in my tweet, I said free pussy riot and hashtag stay woke. After that, woke took off and became many things. Let's talk about it. You bring up that fact, which is your art took this concept. Ideas and words can evolve, but it really put this out, this idea we should wake up to these problems and stay woke. Sure. We made something for you, Eric. This is just like a minute. Okay. But we track how you started it and how it spread and then how some on the right are sort of...

hijacking or attacking it or giving it a different definition. Sure. So I want to play this for you since you bring it up and then we could talk about it. I. Stay woke. It's just urging folks to pay attention to be alert. But stay woke, maybe. Wow. I want my coaches to stay woke, but I want the other coaches that's supporting us to stay woke. Woke fascism that will destroy our nation. We will never, ever surrender to the woke mob. Florida is where woke goes to die. I think they mean black. Yeah. Mm-hmm. It's just another way to say thug or something else, right? Mm-hmm. So you've got the opponents of this kind of using the word wokeers, they're stand in. There's dog whistle they used to call it. Yeah. Yeah. And how do you feel about that? It is what it is. Like we said, it doesn't belong to us anymore. And... You know, once something goes out in the world, it takes a life of its own. It's an energy of its own. I can tell you what woke means. It just means being aware. Being in alignment with nature. Because if you're in alignment with that, you're aware of everything that's going on. And it's not only in the political arena. That means with your health. That means in your relationships. That means in your home. That means in your car. It means in your sleep. I like that. I haven't heard it put quite like that, but you're sort of reminding us, I mean, a big part of politics is just psychology. Yeah. Are people angry? Do they need to blame? Mm-hmm. A big part of psychology is denial. Right. Right. You could be awake to it or you could be asleep to it because to be awake to it might hurt or it might mean you have to do something to feel ethical and people would rather not do anything. That's right. That's like, that's a lack of love in there because... I believe denial is the opposite of love. You sound like you have equanimity or peace about people misusing it. Like, well, you can't control it. Right. That guy we showed Ron DeSantis or Trump or anybody's going to use it for their purposes. You say, well, let them try and that's that. Yeah, and then that's a good. push for us to document our own history, you know, instead of having it documented for us. You know, we have to document what we are doing and who we are if we care about that, you know, if we care about our children knowing the story. And it's not about right and wrong, it's just about the story. Well, you know, I think about that with what they sometimes call traditionally masculine energy. Yeah. Which can sometimes use anger. as a way to fake a feeling of power in a bad situation. In America and around the world, the political potency of just keeping people angry is how some people corruptly hold on the power and they're not helping the people at all. Yeah, I think, yeah, they bank on our ignorance. You know, it's a big business. Our ignorance is their business. Yeah.

So I got one more clip for you that was just interesting to see what almost was people just trying to like, how do you even reference Baddu? How do you put it, you know, because we think in categories, and we talked about briefly why you've always transcended. But we'll show you this. This is back in the day. Okay. Once you feel the vibration from the timber of Erica Badu's voice, you'll understand immediately the comparison to Billy Holiday. What is this new sound on the radio? Is it hip hop, jazz, or some new form of R&B? And the headline says hip hop jazz. Okay. I'll give you my opinion and more importantly, we want yours. Okay, tell me yours. Mine is... When you do something that's actually truly original and different, the first thing that happens is people try to put it back, like, they try to go there. If you succeed with it, then you get imitators. Right. The price of originality is imitation. That's right. So it just seems like you almost were like... pulling it out of them. But I'm curious, do you remember those receptions and there was the term you didn't always love Neo Soul or how do you view that now? Yeah, I remember those things. a little bit because we didn't have social media. I couldn't look back and see everything and pull up all of these things. So we were living in real time. I came off the tail of an era where you had to know a person by just the album cover and the white jumpsuit they had on. Everything that you needed to know had to come from that thing, which was cool. So people didn't really dig deep into people's personal lives and throw the whole person away if they cheated on their taxes. or cheated on their wife or whatever it is that's immoral to society. I remember people describing my music and all that stuff, and I would be like, okay, because it's just me. And it was a little scary, like I said, because it had never been done. Right. You know, those elements had never been put together in that way. We'll say it that way. And I was fine with whatever thing they came up with, but just don't put me in a box so that people will. grow to expect something. Yeah, because I'm changing and growing right now as we speak. In this moment. In this moment. Let's go. Let's go. Well, you know, when you look at the reception, right? Yeah. Method Man said,

A rap critic. He talked about it while I live it. Okay. He's a Pisces. And yet, back in the day, those so-called critics and tastemakers mattered more. Yeah. People said, oh, they're gatekeepers. Yeah. They don't get it. Yeah. Then you get, now everybody's a critic online, and for some artists we hear from, that's even worse because they feel overwhelmed. Or they feel so overwhelmed, they turn it off, so now they're back to analog. It's kind of funny how that happens. So I'm not going to throw a bunch of critics at you, but I got one quote from the same era where they say, Badu is less a descendant of Billy Holiday and Diana Ross than a comment on those predecessors, on the styles and ticks that gave them their power. What does that mean? It's a lot of words. I, well, I'll tell you what I think it means. Okay. That you're not consciously trying to carry on their traditions, but improvving or commenting on, y'all had that. Mm-hmm. Here's how we do it now. Okay. I guess it's so funny, Ari, I hadn't even heard Billy Holiday before. For real? Bodyism. I heard Diana Ross. Okay. Doing Billy Holiday. than had you kind of heard some of Billie Holiday's influence. After I heard. But through Ross. Through Ross. Because I saw the movie Lady Sings the Blues. And through Ross, I thought that style was just beautiful, you know. Because we could grab a younger listener right now and they say, I never heard Isley Brothers? Right. You say, Well, you heard this B.I.G. song? Right. So you have. Yes, you have. So when I finally heard Billy Holiday. I heard Billy Holiday in 1997. It was the same year that I came out because there was so much comparison. And when I heard her, I totally understood. You know, like it was the timbre. It was the raspiness. It was the grit. It was the... the wrongness of it, you know, the notes weren't perfect. So I could see myself in that. And I felt like if I'm making people feel like that, then compare wrong. Compare on. Yeah. Yeah, but it's the right comparison. That's right. Hell yeah. So I got something else that's kind of special. If you want to play with it. Come on, let's play. Let's play. Have you seen any of these artificial intelligence systems like chat GPT? What is that? So it's brand new. Okay. One of them dropped within the last few weeks to public use. So before now. You got one? We're going to use it? I got right here. A piece of paper? I'll explain. Okay. Well, you could decide. All right. But I went into this machine today. Okay. I talked to Machine about you. What machine? This is what I'm telling you. So the artificial intelligence is basically the way that Google gives you all these links. You say, I'm looking for the best hamburger in South Dallas. Uh-huh. You get those links back. Okay.

When that first came out, everyone was like, damn. Right, okay. But now we're used to that, right? Yes. This guy is on a different plane. Okay. Because I said to him, I'm going to tell you what I said. What did you say? Discuss Erica Badu's contributions. Wow. And this is what the artificial intelligence spit back. So the algorithm pulls together data from a... Okay, let's see. Yeah. So, and I didn't bring the computer, you know, show and tell. But I'm going to read you what the bot said based on its learning model. Okay. And if you don't like it, you just tell us. I will. All right. I'll tell him. Yeah, you tell him. Give me his IP. Tell the bot. All right. Quora. Okay. Erica Badu's work is rooted in Afrocentric and black feminist traditions, and her music critiques societal norms and constructs. She embraces her cultural heritage and celebrates blackness, also acknowledging the complexities of black identity. Badu incorporates elements of spirituality and mysticism into her music, drawing on a range of religious and philosophical traditions. Okay. To explore the nature of existence and consciousness. Wow. Final line. Her music can be seen as a form of resistance against dominant cultural narratives and a celebration of alternative ways of being. Wow. I feel like my ancestors wrote that. For real? Yeah. Scale 1 to 10, what would you give that? 10. 10? Yeah. And if they had more time, you know, we'd get some more. But. I think that's it. That's wild. Yeah, that's wild. I love it because I've been listening to you for a long time. I mean, do you, what do you think about it? I think what struck me the most is this bot put into words a thing I felt about your music that I hadn't ever read that way, and I just read a bunch of articles by humans about you in prepping for the interview. But that last point. That the music is not only authentically independent, which I think people will always with, because it's just like, even when they do disagree, if they're honest, if they're not closed mind, it's like, that's really her. Yeah. But. the way they say that then is itself an act of resistance against the way we're being told to live. I was like, that's right. I hadn't thought about it quite like that. That's deep. Right? Yeah, that's how I feel, exactly. And I don't even think I have a song that puts that into words. Fire. Yeah. All right, I got one question from them. Okay, from the bot? Yeah, from the bot. Okay. Are you willing to hear the bot question? My body. Your music explores themes of spirituality. How do you reconcile that with the more commercial aspects of the music industry? I believe I was ahead of my time. I believe that the audience I was writing that music for in the 90s and 97, 2000s, where babies are not born yet. But now they're adults. And they're in the front row of my...

shows, and they understand every single thing I'm saying. But before the critics, you know, deemed me spiritual, weird, you know, there was a category for it. It was kind of off-putting. I really didn't get a lot of endorsements because they didn't know what I was about. But the people won between 1997 and 2005, they understand exactly. what I'm saying. That's how I reconcile. I'm gonna tell you why I love that so much. Right. That's the art mixed with what you called earlier, the confidence, part-time narcissism, the hip-hop bravado, because it's always tricky to compare artists, but... Yeah. Van Gogh, even Warhol at the end of his life, if you read his last diary entries, they... felt the way you did about the independence. Yeah. But they doubted themselves in their own words because of the reception of their time. Yeah. You seem to be able to combine that and be like, no, Van Gogh, like, let it, let it. He lived, so I didn't have to do that. You know, we read those words and those diary entries so that we don't have to do that, the artists who are from his tribe. There's a tribe of humans who are artists, who are tastemakers or cultural influencers or those types of things who have a lot of adverse energy. coming at them at all times because things that people don't understand they like to criticize or kill or assassinate especially if it's not in this society fashion for the consumption of male entertainment as a woman they quickly want to destroy the energy of it and kill it they're not doing it on purpose they don't know you know how could they know how can i know what I'm doing and creating at the time. So it's just the way it is. And it's part of that tax that comes with being an innovator or creator. You know, you have to take everything with it. And that's how the blessings keep coming. You have to accept all of the things that come with your art. I love that. Yeah. And part of your response is to... A non-human bot. To a non-human bot. I mean, we don't know what's going on. Like, I tweeted in 2015 that human beings don't scare me. It's the robots. Right. I'm worried about. I don't know if you remember. Masterpiece said something to the effect of if you bought it, bought it. Right. That way, you bought it, bought it. Right. Yes. That's for those who know. That's for those who know. That's a dad joke for Southern hip-hop heads who know. Stop, don't do that no more. You shouldn't ever tell anybody your age again. Because I feel like I'm talking to a kid from next door right now. You feel like I'm a kid? Yeah, we're 11. Okay. Eleven's good. Yeah. Yeah. So there's no more, I'm a dad and I'm an old man and all of that. Respect. Well, I'll hit you with some Picasso. Hit me with it.

He said, it took me four years to learn to paint like a professional impressionist and a lifetime to learn to paint like a child. Yeah. Bars. Bars. Bars. Yeah, I love it. I feel that because as a mom... raising children, a boy child and girl children. It's super important to me that I'm very careful being the first person to mold these minds because like Picasso, I spend a whole lot of time trying to unlearn. things that were taught to me and taught to my parents and taught to their parents. I'll go back one more, and their parents. Yeah. How much do you think art can help disrupt our conditioning? I think art is the absence of fear. Like when you're creating something, you just, if it's in its truest form, you're just creating. And I think art influences it greatly. You know, teaching my children, I was a homeschooling mom, so teaching my children mad through music or English. through colors, you know, it makes a big difference because it's the way our minds think and see. And when we are subjected to just the left brain activities, it stifles us a lot, you know. Is that the right word? Stifle, yeah, definitely. Yeah, it clenches. Our ass is always clenched because we're afraid to express ourselves in a way because we're afraid to be assassinated. or alienated or single it out, you know. So we're managing our pain by holding our creativity in, which is something I don't want to see young people have to do. Yeah. I have a theory that the reason people have such strong reaction to artists is the fan community is inspired. because people say, man, I'd love to be like Badu. I could never do that, or I couldn't walk around like that, or people wouldn't accept me if I did that. But they're actually inspired by the way you live and present and express. And then the hater community, which has always existed, and you said earlier about the political attack, right? Right. The hater community is... well, if I'm holding this inside, I'm sacrificing, and I've been doing that for years, it's actually unfair. It feels somehow like, I took the wrong bet. Why do you get to be so free? Right. And that curls into a hatred. Sure. Because sometimes I run into people where they're just like, oh, it's like these rappers and they're doing this. And I'm like,

These rappers really got you mad. Got you big mad. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, there's just people. You know, they don't have enough to do. Not enough to do. And we said at the beginning of the interview, Creator does not give you what you ask for. They give you what you are. They match what you are. And... Some of y'all ain't that. You know, if this is not what you're supposed to be doing, it means that you are living someone else's dream. I believe that people should find the thing that comes the easiest to them and master it. Comes the easiest to you, you know, even if it's something, it's going to be useful in society in some kind of way, even if it's someone who just knows how to clean their sneakers really well. There's a lot you can do with that creative idea of just honing into what you do best. Rapper Ransom said, Hardest thing to be in this world is something you're not. That is true. And it's hard, though. Wear you down. It's your will. You mentioned where we started, where I would like to end is with a lightning round in a word or a sentence. Okay. Tiana Taylor. She's fresh. She live. She's... My babe. Lauren Hill. She's live. She's fresh. I feel like Lauren has one of the most angelic voices. She's anointed as a singer. Buster Rhymes. That's my buddy. He's intelligent. He's quick. He's probably one of the most peculiarly intelligent people I've met. Therick, Black Thought. Black Thought were Smith. He is a machine gun. when it comes to rap. Dead press. Dead prayers. Fearless, brave, real. Tupac. Tupac. Underrated still. Notorious B.I.G. Talented, talented, creative, hilarious. Drake. Drake. Change this whole country's... idea of what R&B music should sound like. By himself. By himself. Yeah. Lil Uzivert. The Uzivert. Uzi has neon guts. He's just so happy to be here that it comes out and everything he does. Oof. A little Naz-X. Little Nas X. Very intelligent, free. Yeah, he's free. He's what freedom is. Andre 3000. It's my baby daddy. And if I say anything more, I may be missing with my child support, so I'm not going to get into that. But I'm his biggest fan. Jay Diller. Jay Dilla, an angel on earth. He was an angel on earth. Yassine Bay. Yassine Bay. Most deaf is really most deaf in his words, in his friendship.

in his craft. Yeah. He the most of. Dave Chappelle. Dave Chappelle. National treasure, we will protect him at all costs. Now, these are big picture. These are three conceptual ones. Okay. Energy. Energy. Everything vibrates inside of it, and it cannot be dissipated. It can only be exchanged. Boom. The womb, inside the womb is the universe as above so below. The creation of everything comes from the womb, just as it comes from the noon or the nun. See, confirmation. As you spoke. Birds. As I spoke. Yeah. Feminism. Feminism. The only ism I mess with is Baduism. But I am an advocate for anyone who is being abused. As an artist, being sensitive about my shit means... It means they're just that. I'm very sensitive about my art and creativity because it's a part of me. It's like the fascia of who I am. Yeah. The worst advice I've ever gotten was. The worst advice I've ever gotten was, Erica, you got to let the other people win sometime. What kind of person told you that? Somebody who wanted to win. The best advice I've gotten was. From my grandmother. And she gives everybody in the family the same advice. And when I found that out, I was a little sour. But I appreciated it still. Her advice is always, keep living, it'll come to you. The best advice I've ever given was. The best advice I've ever given was probably today. When I said, the creator does not give you, what you ask for gives you what you are. I thought it was over when. I thought it was over after window seat, you know, because it was such a big, that's the first time I had made national news and went viral in the social media realm. I didn't know what was going to happen when I got home. You know, I thought I was going to go to jail. I didn't know. Because you made that video and then there was some sort of disorderly conduct arrest and then what you felt like you went bad viral? I didn't know. I mean, but I learned after that any viral is good. So whether it's bad or, you know, if it's not something like terribly morally wrong, then any press is a good press. Yeah, that's what they say. I knew I'd made it when. I knew I made it when I was on the cover of Jet Magazine in 1998. Respect. That's right. Failure means. Failure means giving up. Success means. Success means continuing no matter what. Being a maverick means. That you from Dallas, Texas. And I'm the only real maverick in here. Do you all understand me? Y'all see what this is right here? I'm wearing my maps jersey right now. In Dallas, specifically, I am the maverick.

I think there's no better way. Thank you so much, Erica Badu. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Hi, I'm Angie Hicks, co-founder of Angie. When you use Angie for your home projects, you know all your jobs will be done well. roof repair, done well. Kitchen sink install, done well. Deck upgrades, done well. Electrical upgrade, done well. Angie's been connecting homeowners with skilled pros for nearly 30 years, so we know the difference between done and done well. Angie, the one you trust to find the ones you trust. Find a pro for your project at Angie.com.