07-13-26 *FULL SHOW* Sen Lindsey Graham RIP; Sen Jim Banks; Chris Stirewalt; Iran war; Cheesman Park video game creator

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the guy who made it so I can add him so I can collaborate with his channel and put it also on his channel. So I started looking and he posted a video of I created this Cheesman Park game on his Instagram. So then I collaborated with him on the post. So it shows up on both of our pages and reached out to him and said, want to join us for a conversation? Which is funny because I saw he talked with the Denver post and he said, my main goal is that people enjoy this game and the local media picks it up. So I was like, All right. All right. He achieved his goals. So we'll chat with him. And if people want to see your video, what do they do? Go to K-OA on Instagram or just search K-OA in the Instagram search bar and you can find it there. There you go. All right. I will also mention one other thing. This is a ridiculous thing. And then we're going to talk about Lindsey Graham. So right now I'm... I'm wearing a knee brace on my left leg, even though the injury was to my hamstring, not my knee. But the purpose of the knee brace is to keep my leg from fully straightening so that I can't accidentally put too much tension on the hamstring. Anyway, I'm wearing this particular knee brace. So on Friday, I had my two-week post-op appointment at the clinic, at the sports medicine clinic. And I go in, I check in, and I, you know, hanging out, waiting for a couple minutes. And who should walk in behind me, but producer Dragon and his wife. And Dragon is wearing the same knee brace that I'm wearing. And Dragon is going to have surgery tomorrow. And my other friend who hurt his leg after hanging out with me is going to have surgery tomorrow as well. And then anyway, I think Dragon's probably going to be out all this week, and hopefully we'll be back next week. But at that point, you will see both me and Dragon wearing the same kind of knee brace. Gina, anything to say about that? I don't know. No. No, there really isn't much to add. It kind of speaks for itself. I just hope there's not a third, but I guess your friend is the third. Yeah, my friend is a third. Plus, you did the Sage. And the Palo Santa would. So I think you guys are really finding out how handicapped friendly our building is, though. You're like testing out everything to make sure that people can get around. It actually is not bad. The one thing that I have to do, when we come in this early in the morning, you have to use a key card to access the elevator. And so what I do, because it's hard for me to get from the key card swipy location to the elevator button. Oh, yeah. Before the key card swipy thing turns back off. So what I do is I swipe the key card and then I use one of my crutches, the end of the crutch to bang the elevator button. So I don't have to walk over there. That's smart. And it works out pretty well. All right. So we have a lot to say about Lindsey Graham today. And as I said, we've got guests to talk about it. Now, Lindsey Graham was supposed to be on the Sunday shows yesterday. He came back from the NATO meeting and then from Ukraine. And then some hours later, he had passed away. And he was supposed to be on the Sunday shows. And NBC and Kristen Welker got in touch with President Trump and invited him.

to be on Meet the Press yesterday, essentially in Lindsey Graham's spot. And they talked about him quite a bit, and I just wanted to share a little bit of it with you. By the way, all of the audio that I'm going to share with you today about Lindsey Graham, buy Lindsey Graham, more about than by, is up on the blog. If you go to rosskomensky.com, it'll take you to my substack, and I hope you will subscribe. It's absolutely free to subscribe, and you will get the show blog every day. every day that there is a show. And you will also get occasional other articles that I write. So again, rosskaminski.com and just put your email address in, become an absolutely free subscriber. And I think it'll, it'll, uh, make you a smarter consumer of news, and you'll get information that is useful, but also stuff that's just fun and entertaining, like something Gene and I will talk about later with a bison throwing a grandpie feet in the air. But anyway, here's President Trump on Meet the Press yesterday. So what makes it even stranger is that I got a call last night sometime, you know, the early evening, maybe in the sevens. And he called, and he said, we're all set for the Save America Act. He was pushing the Save America Act like crazy. He got back, said he just landed from Ukraine. I said, that's a long trip to make it. He said, he sounded a little tired, but perfect, but a little bit tired. I had a right to be. And he was a worker. No, he was really a worker. But he sounded great, actually. But he was, he actually said he was tired. But he wanted to pass the Save America Act. And I said, well, we're going to get it done, Lindsay. We're going to get it done. I'll see you like soon. We thought we might even meet today. This is the AC. All right. So, yeah, that tried to go to an ad there. But that's where I was going to stop anyway. So President Trump had a lot of things to say before that. He talked about Lindsey Graham as almost like a member of the family. Lindsey Graham is a complicated legacy. You heard a little bit of it from Steve John Roberts in his conversation with Gina just 15 minutes ago. But Lindsey Graham definitely had a complicated legacy. There are so many aspects of the guy that I want to talk about, which is why I'm going to do it over the course of the entire show. But let me just throw one thing out there that really isn't so much a matter of judgment about policy or personality or anything. But... Lindsey Graham was everywhere. And he was probably, and I think Steve John Roberts said this, he was probably the best known senator to most Americans. And certainly the best known senator. outside of your own state for probably the vast majority of Americans. In fact, it wouldn't surprise me if more Colorans could identify and name Lindsey Graham than to name either of Colorado's senators. And I'm just going to throw this out there as a little concept, and we're going to keep going with this over the course of the show.

But if anything happened to cause either of our Colorado senators to disappear, and I'm not talking about sudden death, okay? I'm just saying if suddenly one of them was gone, they retired, right? They went to the Appalachian Trail, right? You remember that story. They just, whatever, they just went away. Could any of you tell me anything that either of our current senators, if you can even name them, Could any of you tell me anything that either of them has accomplished as a senator or actually believes in? I kind of doubt it. Your medical freedom is worth protecting. That's why Jace is offering massive savings on life-saving medications this July. Enjoy membership to Jace Plus for just $17.76 for the entire year, where you'll receive ongoing discounts and 24-7 access to a first aid helpline all year round. You'll also find special pricing on the Jace case, Jace trauma, Ivermectin, and more medical tools to keep you and your loved ones emergency ready. The sale ends July 31st. Visit jace.com. That's jase.com to learn more and save on peace of mind. All right, good morning. Happy Monday. I hope you enjoyed your weekend. If you had gone to... Waterworld, probably the best known water park around here on Saturday, then at some point likely you would have been evacuated due to an emergency. It wasn't actually an emergency. It was a potential threat. Apparently it was a bomb threat. And Waterworld had to evacuate about 4,000 people and shut down for the rest of the day on Saturday afternoon. And from our news partners at KDVR, KDVR.com, enforcement determined that there was no credible threat to the park. following an extended investigation, right? And then later in this article, they talk about if you were there and you left stuff, when you can go back and pick up your stuff. But in any case, during a press conference on Saturday, law enforcement said the response came after a caller with a robotic sounding voice reported a bomb threat at the park. Officials say they are unsure whether Saturday's false threat was a local incident or connected to the nationwide trend of reported threats at amusement parks in recent days. On Thursday, the Enchanted Forest Park in Turner, Oregon was evacuated after a bomb threat. Wild Island Water Park in Nevada was also evacuated on Thursday after a report of someone with a gun on the property. So here is my question for you. What is the proper punishment for someone who is found to have done this?

I think it's got to be pretty severe. I think that we need to dissuade people from doing this kind of stuff in the future. I don't, you know, I don't know what the right answer is, but maybe it's, I don't know, I don't know if this is too harsh, but I'll just throw it out there. Maybe it's something like a day in prison or maybe an hour. I don't know, you decide, but for every person who gets evacuated because of your call. Right? So, so Waterworld was 4,000 people. So 4,000 days in prison, 11 or 12 years. Might be a little harsh, but you know what? You got to send a message. You really have to stop these people. And there's all kinds of stuff where these crimes that really impact quality of life. And this in a way is one, you know, petty crime and shoplifting and stuff like that also. And it's, you know, you may find it a little unusual coming from a guy who is against the death penalty. But I'm not against the death penalty because I think some people don't deserve to die. It's just that I don't trust the government. to execute the right people right so you got to keep in mind those things are very very different and so i'm i'm kind of old school about this and when people are doing things that are really harming other people's lives and especially lots of people all at once like that i think i think the punishment needs to be really really harsh. And I don't care whether, you know, maybe it's a 17 year old goofing around. I don't necessarily want to destroy somebody's life for what they might have been thinking of as a prank. But at some point, you just have to show people that if you do this, the cost is simply not going to be worth it. So don't do it. Don't do it. We're going to do a little news weather and traffic and then we got to talk about what the heck is going on with the war with Iran. Is the Strait of Hormuz open? Is it not open? Is it ever going to be the same? What is going on? And we can tie that in a little bit to the passing of Lindsey Graham, who had a lot to say about Iran. All right, good morning. I'm Ross. Thanks for spending a little time with me. Epic Gina in studio as well. Gina, Kristen and I watched Hamnet on Netflix this weekend. Have you seen it? No. It's quite good. Do you have Netflix? That's what I've heard. I do, yes. Yes, it's, it's real, it's really good. It's, uh, Shakespearean. Movie? The plot. The plot relates to Shakespeare. The dialogue is mostly, you know, normal dialogue, although, you know, said in England in the 1600s. It's not like you're watching a Shakespeare play, except for a few minutes of it, where you literally are. Is it a Netflix series or is it a movie? It's a movie. And it won, the actress, Emily Watson? Cleaned up, didn't it? Yeah, it got a couple.

It had eight nominations. I think the only thing at won was best actress. Okay. But really good. Really good. And if you like, yeah, it's a wonderful story. A little bit of Shakespeare, love story, tragedy, drama, a little of everything. It has an 86% on Rotten Tomatoes. I think you'd like it. 93% on the... Popcorn meter. Excellent. So, yeah. That's pretty good. I think, I think you dig it. I was thinking about one battle after another. Yeah. You know, which one best picture. The thing is that the stars of that movie, DiCaprio, Sean Penn, and Benio Del Toro are all, especially Del Toro, these like, rabid leftists and it makes it, I know you don't think about movies that way, but it's hard for me to watch, especially Del Toro. Are you saying you haven't seen it? I have not seen it. I want to see it and I think I'm not going to. I would love to know your take on that movie. Gosh, it's a difficult call for me because Benicio del Toro is such a raging anti-Semite. I really don't want to watch his stuff. I really think it would be interesting to hear what you think about that movie. All right. Maybe I will. Maybe. All right, we'll see. Let's talk about what's going on with Iran. So a moment ago, Gina mentioned to you what's going on with stock index futures today down modestly. Oil around $74. So that's up about $3 today and up about a little over $6 from about a week ago. So oil's up about $1. Let's call it 10% from about a week ago when it seemed pretty clear that the so-called memorandum of understanding or the ceasefire or however you want to talk about it between the U.S. and Iran was crumbling. Now, I have to say, I'm glad it's crumbling. I've said this for a while. I supported Donald Trump beginning this action against Iran. Iran needs to be dealt with. They have needed to be dealt with for most of my adult life. No president has had the courage to deal with them. Ronald Reagan's biggest mistake of his presidency was walking away and not retaliating against Iran after the murder of 241 U.S. Marines at the barracks in Beirut in 1983. And Reagan just turned tail and ran. Trump is the first one not to. So I'm glad about that. But what I've said from the beginning of all this is you should not start a war unless you're willing to win it. And for most of this, this, you know, President Trump seemed, he seemed committed to the mission for a very little while. And then he seemed to tire of it for one reason or another, perhaps the, you know, considering what the high gasoline prices and just generally being at war is going to do to Republicans in the midterms. And so he backed off and he seemed far too eager to get a deal. And the Iranians could see that as well. And so the Iranians began negotiating with the Trump administration as if they, meaning the Iranians, were winning or at least tying. And in a way, they were right because we let him get away with so much stuff. Now it seems that President Trump is reconsidering that somewhat softer approach. I don't know, to the extent you can call.

being at war at all, a softer approach, and has started striking Iran again aggressively. Now, I've had one headline after another for days and days and days, and rather than quote any one of them, I'll just paraphrase, because they're all very similar. And it is something along the lines of centcom struck 70 or 90 or 140 or whatever the number is. Iranian targets mostly... mostly air defense radar and missile launch locations. And every time I see a headline like that, what I wonder to myself is, why are there any of those targets left to hit? I realize that some of this stuff can be mobile. And every once in a while, they're moving this stuff around and you have to catch them, you know, fire something from a spot or you see something on a satellite that wasn't there yesterday and you take it out. But I believe that a lot of these... targets are not mobile. And we just haven't struck them. And it's an enormous mistake. And it's the reason that Iran keeps acting like they're winning. Now, the other thing that happened is that in the memorandum of understanding. And I don't have the wording in front of me, but I believe it's the fifth section of the Memorandum of Understanding. It talks about the future of the Strait of Hormuz, and it was badly worded. Now, keep in mind, we probably don't have our very best people negotiating this stuff if we're sending Steve Witkoff. And Jared Kushner, who's better than Steve Witkoff, but... you know, to negotiate against the Iranians, they're really just not up to that. The Iranians are the best negotiators and cheaters in the world, and you are not going to charm them into doing something you want them to do the way Steve Witkoff and Jared Kushner might have been able to charm, let's say, the Saudis, or the Moroccans or something like that, to do something that. that they wanted done. So this particular provision regarding the Strait of Hormuz was written badly. And it was written in a way that it allows Iran, I mean, they may be stretching it a little bit, but that allows them to claim that they think that it means that after 60 days, Iran gets control over traffic of the Strait of Hormuz and maybe even the ability to... to impose tolls, to impose a fee for ships crossing the Strait of Hormuz, which is wildly illegal under international law. These are not Iranian waters. These are international waters. And so what's been happening is that some ships have been crossing on the other side of the Strait of Hormuz down by Oman and Iran started attacking them. Well, along with... President Trump's determination that Iran not get a nuclear weapon, he is also determined that they must not control the Strait of Hormuz. And in fact, what's really happened, and I think this is an interesting strategic point, is that Iran has realized that the ability to control the Strait of Hormuz...

gives them as much leverage or about as much leverage. You can quibble as to which one is more, but as having a nuclear weapon does, right? If you can strangle some part of the world's economy, maybe not quite strangle it to death, but certainly impose massive costs, that's a big deal. And it gives them leverage to, well, for whatever they want, really. And so. Trump understands that Iran cannot have that leverage. Trump understands that for the same reasons, not the same, similar reasons to why they can't have a nuclear weapon. They also can't control the strait. Iran is saying this document you agreed to allows us to control the straight and the U.S. is saying it doesn't. And again, you can understand if you read the document why Iran at least thinks they can claim that. But President Trump is not in the mood to let him get away with it. We've been attacking them every day now for a few days. Over the weekend, Iran said that the Strait of Hormuz is closed. The United States Central Command said, quote, Iran does not control the strait. Traffic is flowing. Well, we'll see. We'll see. Traffic is definitely down from a few weeks ago. It is up a little bit from when the straight was truly closed, but it all depends on how much risk ship owners and crews and insurers are willing to take. And when it comes to that, we don't really know. And that's why oil is up 10% in a week. Obviously, the death of Lindsey Graham was quite a shocker over the weekend. His office is saying, well, no, the medical examiner is saying it appears he died of aortic dissection. That's when you have a weak part of the main artery coming out of your heart and blood starts to flow through a tear, a small tear in it. But then the pressure of the blood starts forcing the blood into the tissue itself and starts making the tear bigger and bigger and bigger. And it's something that potentially could be survived for a very short time if someone got surgery to repair it more or less immediately. But it's also something that can kill you very, very fast. And apparently, Lindsey Graham called 911 chest pain. When first responders got there, the deadbolt was latched. And I don't know how they said, all right, we're going to just knock it down. I don't know how long it took them to knock it down. I don't know if they had to wait for police to knock it down. I don't know that it would have made any difference anyway. And by the time, in any case, when they got there, they did CPR and at that point it was too late. And with that kind of injury, of course, CPR is not going to help, right? The only thing that can help is surgery to repair the tear immediately. You're basically bleeding out internally at a very, very rapid rate. They said it is due to cardiovascular disease.

And I don't know anything about Lindsey Graham's habits when it comes to smoking and drinking and all that. I do know just as kind of an amusing story. He was raised in a, he was, well, that's a little strong to say raised in a bar, but his parents had a bar. And he was there a lot. And he used to tell stories about when he was a kid that if. If a patron would leave and perhaps leave half a beer there or something, he'd go pick it up and drink it. Sometimes he'd finish their cigarette, too, when he was a kid. The guy certainly had an interesting life. When he was 19 years old in University of South Carolina, he was a student of University of South Carolina. His mom died. And then 15 months later, his dad died. So he's 19. He's in college. He's got a 13-year-old sister. And so he officially adopts his sister and basically becomes his sister's. parent and raises her. And I don't know if that has anything to do with why he never got married and doesn't have kids of his own. There's some speculation out there about that. I don't really care about any of that except that, you know, it's interesting that he never got married. but in any case, quite an upbringing. Now, one of the things about Lindsey Graham, we talked about Iran a moment ago, he was one of the most hawkish against Iran in the Senate. There are a few others, you know, Marco Rubio, who's not in the Senate anymore, obviously, but there are a few others very hawkish against Iran. Lindsey Graham has understood Iran for a long, long time. After all, Lindsey Graham got into politics in the 90s, not that long after. the attack on the barracks in Beirut. So he still had that fresh in his memory and he's never forgotten it. And President Trump has never forgotten it either. Now, one of the things I appreciated about Lindsey Graham. And I will say there are plenty of things I disagreed with him on, and we'll get to that later. But one of the things I appreciated about him was his steadfast support for Israel, even though it's become fashionable in certain sections of the Republican Party and way too much of the Democratic Party to be anti-Israel, which I think for most people these days is really just anti-Semitism being disguised. as having a problem with Israel. I think there's a very small percentage of people who have some kind of issue with Israel for some reason who aren't necessarily anti-Semitic, but that's a small minority. Lindsey Graham was never going along with that crowd. He always understood who the good guys are. And again, that's not to say that Israel is always perfect, but just like the United States isn't always...

Perfect. But that doesn't mean you can't recognize, you know, in World War II, who's the good guy between the U.S. and Nazi Germany. I mean, maybe Tucker Carlson can't recognize the difference, but normal people can. So here's just a brief clip of Benjamin Netanyahu, who was also on Meet the Press yesterday after President Trump was, talking about Lindsey Graham. And I'm in a state of shock. Because as President Trump said, Lindsay was so vibrant. He was so full of life. He was so full of energy and dedication that it's hard to accept the fact that he is no more. I think America has lost a great patriot. Israel has lost one of the great champions of the American-Israeli alliance. And frankly, I've lost... A beloved friend who I've had for many decades. There's just no one like him. Well, Mr. I'll leave that there. But you get the idea. And one of the things I would say about Lindsey Graham, again, I've got a lot more to say over the course of the show. And we're going to talk with a couple of folks who knew him, including Senator Jim Banks from Indiana coming up 40 minutes from now. One of the things you can say about Lindsey Graham is that, On the vast majority of policies, and for sure on foreign policy, you knew where he stood. And I think that's a valuable thing. Now, I didn't always agree with him. I didn't always agree with him, but I know where he is. I know pretty much what he believes in. I know pretty much what to expect from him. And let me just contrast that, if I might, for a brief moment, with one of our senators, Michael Bennett, who I think is probably a decent person. In fact, I'm sure that Michael Bennett is a decent human being. But I'm telling you, as we were going through the process in this state of getting to and through the primary election, one of the things that I said on the air and also to Michael Bennett's staff, although I did not say it to him personally because I don't really know him. was that this guy's been in the Senate for about 16 years, believe it or not, and I cannot tell you what he stands for and what he believes. You would never say that about Lindsey Graham.

And I mentioned a little bit ago that the medical examiner in Washington, D.C. is reporting that Lindsey Graham died of aortic dissection. And then we got this listener text. Ross, I'm a survivor of aortic dissection a year ago on the 10th. I had a fast diagnosis, a helicopter flight, and a seven and a half hour surgery. I didn't have arterioschlorosis and I was in pretty good shape and six years younger than Graham, a tough rehab at first, but I've regained 90% of my strength and 50% of my endurance. So wow, fantastic. Great survival story. And a moderate percentage of people who have this issue survive, but only if you get care really, really fast. So in any case, there's that. Lindsey Graham, a listener asked, wasn't his nickname Lindsey Graham because he was always pushing for amnesty for illegal immigrants. So let me talk about that for a second. Actually, just use it as a way to get into a bigger picture thing about him. Yes, some people did nickname him that some of the more anti-immigrant folks in politics or in the immigration policy area. I wouldn't say he was. You know, as the listener put it, always pushing for amnesty, but rather he was in favor of a large comprehensive immigration reform bill that would have included what you might call amnesty. It would have included allowing some illegal immigrants who have been in the country for a long time and not committed crimes to stay here. And it would have been part of a bigger deal, though, where there would have been actual control of the border, like we do have right now, by the way, proving that it can be done, and some other things. And the thing with that kind of deal that is often called comprehensive immigration reform. is that that is the kind of deal that the majority of Americans would go along with. But because we have, especially these days, right, even more than back when that conversation was going on, these days we have politics being dominated by the fringes, right? You've got actual members of the House and Senate. who are fringy, kook lunatics on both sides of the aisle. And by the way, it's only going to get worse, especially on the Democratic side. They're going to elect a bunch of truly radical, reprehensible socialists to the House of Representatives. But the thing is, even when you've got members of the House and Senate who aren't that crazy, they are afraid of losing their primary elections. to people who are that crazy. So even if the folks who are in government are not part of the fringe, they will sometimes govern as if they are because they are afraid of the fringe. Does that make some sense? And so this kind of comprehensive immigration reform that earned Lindsey Graham, the nickname Lindsey Gramnesty,

is actually a kind of deal that obviously the details matter, but in general, I support that kind of deal. I think that it's kind of nuts to think we're going to get rid of every illegal immigrants in the country. I also think it's economic suicide if we were to somehow magically snap our fingers and get rid of them all. And in the meantime, if you think about the politics of it, for Donald Trump, immigration, has always been one of his, let's say, top two strongest issues, right? I would say it was probably his number one issue back in 2016 and his number two issue after cost of living in 2024. And because the Trump administration, but because Donald Trump let Stephen Miller. And Kristi Noem, who by the way, did not get along all that well, but he let those two determine what should happen with immigration enforcement. And so you had those two murders of American citizens by federal agents in Minnesota. And then you just had apparently another murder, not of an American, but of an illegal alien. I think that was in, was that in Texas? In any case, I actually haven't talked about that story, but these unmarked SUVs tried to pin in this van, driven by an illegal alien who has been in the country for about 30 years, never committed a crime, was actually in the process. of getting his whatever the relevant paperwork is. He had submitted his fingerprints to the government so he could get his work permit. He's just a hardworking guy driving his van with his tools to get to work. And these unmarked vehicles start surrounding him. His kid says that his dad was really afraid of being robbed and having his tools stolen, which had happened in the past. So when these unmarked vehicles started getting around him. He tried to take off. Now, there isn't a lot of video about this. So we're still trying to sort it out. But long story short, is the federal agents shot him and killed him. He was not. not the target of the enforcement action going on that morning. The feds picked up the wrong guy. They found the wrong van and they chased the wrong guy and then they killed him. And then the fed said that he was, just like they said about these people in Minnesota, that he was putting them at risk, right? What they said about Renee Good, that she was a threat and she was going to drive over the federal agent. And it was a lie and he murdered her. And I think that that's what happened here as well. I think the feds are lying and I think they murdered somebody else. Now, I know that sounds harsh and I know there's some people listening right now where probably yelling at your radios and you're welcome to do that. You are welcome to your opinion and I am welcome to mine. But in any case, my point is that because of actions like that, President Trump has now turned immigration from one of his...

biggest positive issues into a negative. It's now a negative for him among voters, and that shows the difference between policy and execution. The policy concepts were mostly fine. The execution was a disaster. And taking it back now to Lindsey Graham, if we had had the kind of immigration reform that Lindsey Graham supported, that plenty of others supported, that I support, but that is blocked by a few fringe people on the right. primarily on the right, who are against anything that allows any illegal immigrant to stay in the country, then you, you know what, you deserve whatever happens to you with that issue turning from a positive to a negative. You had a chance to do something good and you screwed it up. It's one of the things that Lindsey Graham was right on. I disagreed with him on a lot of stuff, but he was right about that. All right, let's light it up for a couple minutes. And then we're going to be joined by Senator Jim Banks from Indiana who knew Lindsey Graham quite well. But Gina sent me a headline or actually a link to an event about a Harry Potter drone show. And by the way, I've never seen a drone show. I've only seen like pictures or videos of drone shows on TV and they look freaking amazing. And maybe maybe better than fireworks. I don't know. But you, so you saw this one or kind of? I'm surprised that you haven't seen one yet because I feel like Denver like end of the year pretty much. Thanksgiving to New Year's. They're like doing a drone show every single night, just constantly launching them often. I don't get out much. Yeah, I guess so. And I guess they're going to be doing a ton for Colorado's 150th, too. But yeah, over the weekend, they had a Harry Potter drone show. And this was actually put on by a company, not through the city, called Drone Art Shows. And they did a Harry Potter edition. It was taking place at the Tipoli Quad on the Araria campus, Friday night and Saturday night. And... I was like not doing much Friday night. So I was like, Kyle, I was like, let's just go walk down there, check it out. And we watched it from a distance, not paying the $55 per ticket. It was for adults to watch it on the Tivoli Quad or 30 bucks for kids. And now here's the thing. It was a 60-minute show. 1200 plus drones. So really impressive, bigger, way bigger scale than what Denver's been doing as of late. And then it was also like they had music accompanied with it at the Tivoli Quad so you could listen to the music, watch scenes from the movie that is being, you know, launched up in the sky through these drones. But then I thought about it and I was like, how are we going to start? charging people to see these drone shows when they have to go so high in the sky that we just watched it maybe from half a mile away perfectly. Obviously, you didn't have the music to it or anything like that, but I was like,

It was the first time I saw a ticketed event for a drone show, and I just wasn't sure if it's going to have the success. I have no idea if it was successful or not. I had a lot of people talk about the reviews saying it was great to watch, and I enjoyed watching it for free. I don't know if I would have enjoyed watching it for $55. All right. So if the upside were getting the music and getting to watch clips of the movie while you're watching the drone show, how much would you be willing to pay? The kid price of 30 bucks, maybe? Yeah, even that sounds a little high. A little high. Yeah. Yeah, I was going to say 20. Now, that's what Kyle said too, because we had this conversation when we were looking at it. And I think they were smart in the way of when they launched the drones. They were may, may have been launching it from one side of the tiboli quad for the first half. Then they had an intermission and launched it from the second, you know, the other half for the second half because we had a perfect shot in the first half. Wow, everything looks great. And then before we knew it, we were like, everything looks backwards. So maybe they were smart in the way that they purposely launched it differently, where you could only see it if you were at the Tivoli Quad perfectly, turn your head to the right, turn your head to the left. But when we were watching it from further away, not in the paid area, it looked kind of wonky for the second half. So maybe they're finding a way to monopolize on it and get people to pay for it. But to me, I was like, I don't know if we're going to be able to continue these paid admission drone shows. Well, they can't be cheap to put on, right? I mean, to buy the drones, program them, the people doing all the creative. That's got to cost some real money. And so you definitely do have a free rider problem there and you embodied it. Sorry. No need to apologize to me. Senator Jim Banks from Indiana, new Lindsey Graham quite well, actually from before Jim even got to the Senate. Jim joins us next to talk about it. I thought that in the, with the passing of Lindsey Graham, the sudden, shocking, unexpected passing of Lindsey Graham that I would very much like to have on the show somebody who knew him. And Senator Jim Banks, a friend of mine, I've known Jim for a very long time before he ran for office, he's a Republican senator from Indiana. He, of course, knew Lindsey Graham from the Senate, but he also knew Lindsey Graham from well before that because... Jim served in the United States Navy and was deployed overseas. Lindsey Graham served in the United States Air Force as a JAG officer, and they did meet in Afghanistan, I think. And I just thought it would be good to have Jim here and share a few stories about Lindsey Graham. So Senator Jim Banks, thanks for making time for us. Hey, good morning, Ross. Good to be with you. Obviously. We're all shocked. I woke up yesterday morning. Lindsey Graham was larger than life in the Senate. Every generation has its famous one or two senators. And Lindsey Graham was that senator of this generation, this era. Very effective, but also larger than life. And we head back to Washington today. I'm in my hometown in northeast Indiana.

right now, but I'm going to get on a plane here in a few hours and fly back to Washington. It just won't be the same without him. Tell us how you met the first time. Well, I was serving at the time in Afghanistan back in 2014 and 2015, and I was a state senator in Indiana at the time, but I took a leave of absence from politics to deploy as a Navy reservist. It was about halfway through my deployment that Lindsey Graham came to the headquarters base in Kabul, Afghanistan. and did his two weeks of annual training as an Air Force Reserve JAG officer. And even he admitted that that was unusual. But at the same time, he was a senator in real life. So for him to put on the uniform and come to the headquarters base with all the generals that he was grilling before the committees as a colonel in his military life was an unusual experience. But I had a general on the base. who knew that back in my civilian life, I was a state senator, and he thought it would be funny to pair me up with... U.S. Senator Graham acting as Colonel Graham. And so I spent a couple of days on the base shadowing him and escorting him as a junior officer myself. And I remember just a couple of funny stories from that experience. I was a state senator deployed, but there were rumors going on back home in Indiana that my senator at the time was going to retire and that my... congressman was going to run to replace him. And I told Senator Graham or Colonel Graham in that moment that I might one day, when I go back home after the deployment, I might run for Congress because my senator might retire. And I remember him saying, Jim, there's no way that's going to happen. I know your senator. I know he's going to run again. There's no way that's going to happen. Well, it did happen. I came home and the senator retired and I ran for Congress. I won my primary. And I reached out to Senator Graham and his office and asked if I could come see him. At that point, my house district in Indiana was a very Republican district. So I knew after winning my primary that I was likely, what I didn't take it for granted, but likely was going to be a congressman. So I went to him for advice. And I remember walking through the hallways of the Senate, which I know well now was Senator Graham.

He asked me what committees I want to be on. I told him I want to be on the Armed Services Committee. And he said, well, I'm going to call Speaker Ryan. I'm going to call Kevin McCarthy. I'm going to call Mack Thornberry, the chairman of the committee. And this conversation went on for well over a half an hour as we were as we were walking him to a meeting. He's going to do this for me. He's going to do that for me. And then he abruptly paused again about after a half an hour. And he looked at me and he goes, what's your name again? And it was it was a funny moment, but a moment that I still I still joked with him about it. even recently about that moment. And he would often joke about that in return. And he was very, very funny, but also very gracious and very effective. I mean, his relationship with Donald Trump was, was in so many ways an unusual and unlikely, but very, very influential relationship that he built with Donald Trump. A former adversary that the two of them became very close friends. And I know President Trump relied on him quite a bit. And that relationship made the Senate work better. It made the president stronger. And it's a relationship that's going to be hard to replace in the Senate over the next two and a half years left in this Trump presidency. Well, Senator Banks, you're not the first one to. talk about his humor and wit. I felt like that was the first reaction that a lot of people had when we heard about his passing. But you also mentioned him. Ross, I lose you. Oh, can you hear me there? Can you hear Gina or no? Hello, hello. I cannot. Oh, no. Try it, try it again. Shannon's messing with the board there. Let's try it one more time. How about now? Does that work? I can hear you now. Ah, okay, there we go. I wanted to go back to you saying that he was larger than life in the Senate. I'm curious about how were lawmakers that didn't see eye to eye with him? Why did they just respect him so much? Well, he was very passionate. I mean, everyone, everyone remembers the moment on the Judiciary Committee and the Brett Kavanaugh hearings. He was passionate. Well, he was often. just as passionate behind closed doors. I mean, we had our, we, we, we have lunch together in the Senate, the Senate Republicans every single day. And those, those, uh, lunch meetings are often a conversation about what's going on and the, the big issues of the day. And Lindsey Graham would often, would often, uh, you know, he was, he, he, he would speak, he didn't speak all the time. But when he spoke, uh, he spoke, uh, he spoke with passion and. He could be on the other side of you one day and then your biggest advocate the next day. And I think everyone became accustomed to that and understood that Lindsey Graham was a very powerful ally. He could influence other people. He traveled constantly. Whenever we have a recess week, he's on a CODEL traveling around the world and would frequently often, more often than not, have Democrats.

that would travel with him. And one of my first CODELs when I was in the House was with Senator Graham to the Munich Security Conference. And there were more, there were as many Democrats on that trip that he organized and hosted as there were Republicans. And he built that kind of relationship and rapport with, with Democrats. And I think he, I think he just under, he understood the institution. He understood how the Senate could work, how the Senate could be effective and powerful. And that requires relationships on both sides of the aisle. But often some of the most strained relationships were with people of the same party who thought very differently than Senator Graham did about the world and about national security and America's role in the world. And he would spar with those senators in private. And even sometimes in public or on the floor of the Senate, but then he'd go play a round of golf with Rand Paul and they would find common ground and areas where they could work together. I think that made him a very effective senator. As a brand new senator, there are a lot of lessons that I can draw from that. Jim, we got about one minute left. I want to ask you about the Russia-Ukraine thing in the context of the passing of Lindsey Graham. President Trump has been kind of A little wobbly, I have thought, at least until recently, regarding that. It seems pretty clear to me who the good guys are there. And it's always been clear to Lindsey Graham. And I guess he was working on a big Russian sanctions, Bill. Do you think that the kind of influence that Lindsey Graham had on President Trump? to side with Ukraine, frankly. Do you think that's going to be picked up by anybody else? And do you think anything like a Russia sanctions bill will be passed kind of to honor Lindsey Graham, even though the biggest champion of the bill, Lindsey Graham, isn't there anymore? Yeah, I imagine that this sanctions bill probably does move forward. And Senator Graham had been frequently in discussions. even hours before he passed away with President Trump, specifically about the Russian sanctions bill. He had just returned from Ukraine. And I wouldn't say President Trump, to be fair, I wouldn't say wobbly. This sanctions bill has been a conversation for the last year and a half. How can President Trump negotiate? a deal to end the war in Ukraine and back Russia off if he doesn't have maximum flexibility. So any sanctions bill that would take away negotiating power from President Trump is something that the President and the White House have pushed back on. But I think the sanctions bill has evolved and changed so much. And as President Trump becomes... more and more convinced that Vladimir Putin is never going to keep up his end of any deal, that he's going to continue to lie and cheat and manipulate that he can't be trusted, which I think President Trump is clear-eyed about, then the sanctions becomes the more real option on the table. I always thought the sanctions bill was sort of a strengthened the president's hand that it had so much support in the Senate.

But we didn't want to tie the president's hands. And that's a conversation as Senator Graham was having with President Trump all the way up to two or three hours before he passed. And I imagine at this point it's very likely the bill will move forward. Senator Jim Banks, Republican from Indiana. Thanks so much for making time for us, Jim, to talk about your good friend and colleague. I appreciate it. Have a good day. You too. All right, that's Senator Jim Banks. He'll be flying back to D.C. The Senate is not going to be the same place. This episode sponsored by She's Birdie. Every woman knows that feeling, and She's Birdie knows it too. The just-in-case feeling. Just in case I hear something. Just in case someone tries the door. Just in case I need to wake up fast. It's not fear, it's awareness. And Birdie Box from She's Birdie was made for exactly that. Birdie Box is a portable travel door alarm designed by She's Bertie for hotels, dorms, Airbnbs, and anywhere you're staying away from home. It installs in seconds on the doorframe. And if the door is opened, it activates a loud siren and flashing strobe to help draw attention instantly. She's Birdie, because peace of mind should check in with you. Birdie Box by She's Birdie. Visit she's birdie.com. That's S-H-E-B-I-R-D-I-E.com. And order your Bertie box before your next day away from home. I'm Ross. Thanks for being here talking a lot about Senator Lindsey Graham's passing. I think he was a fascinating character and we'll talk more about him in the next segment of the show in a little less than 15 minutes with Chris Steyerwalt, who I think is maybe the best political analyst in America and interviewed Lindsey Graham many times. And so on. So that'll be coming up pretty soon. Now, I saw a piece in the Wall Street Journal entitled One Secret to Zohran Mamdani's Political Success. And I don't spend a ton of time talking about politics outside of Colorado. You know, if it's super interesting, I do. But the reason that I wanted to mention this to you is that... The dynamic described in this piece about New York is a thing that it feels to me. And I'm not saying I'm not saying I have data on this, okay? This is just my gut instinct. And I could well be wrong. But it feels to me like this is a dynamic that is already playing out in Denver and is going to continue playing out in Denver. And let me just describe to you what the Wall Street Journal says. says here. We've been telling you for years about the flight of taxpayers from New York, so it's nice to get confirming evidence from the New York State comptroller's office of all places. The comptroller, Thomas DiNapoli, rolled out a new migration dashboard on Friday that proves the point and may explain why this taxpayer flight is leading to the political rise of socialists. The data provide more evidence.

That pandemic lockdowns fueled an exodus from the state with over 112,000 tax filers on net Vamusing in 2020. That's one out of every 100. resident taxpayers in New York. Then over the next three, four years, another 96,000 or so moved out. And again, this includes only people who file tax returns, not the broader population, because in the broader population, of course, many people don't pay state income tax returns. Many people don't pay state income tax. So. Out migration has slowed down a bit in the last couple of years, but still high income earners and married people are continuing to leave New York in large numbers, about almost 14,000 taxpayers, about one in a thousand. taxpayers left the state in 2024. And the comptroller's office says the greatest loss was among married filers with incomes between $100,000 and $500,000. So they've got all kinds of issues, right? They've got high cost of living. They've got very bad public schools despite spending an immense amount of money because they let the unions dominate so much. By the way, enrollment in New York City public schools has fallen by 118,000 students since 2019. Now, the comptroller, what the comptroller calls a positive trend. is an influx into the state of single people who are filing taxes. These include young urban progressives who form New York City mayors or on Zohran Mamdani's base and propelled his socialist comrades to victory. So what they're saying is that... What it looks like is happening is young people who make much less money than people who've been in the workforce for longer and may have jobs that don't pay very much at all. And, you know, some kind of community organizer or you work for a nonprofit or something. So they're moving into the city and voting for the socialists who say, we're going to steal the money from the rich people and give it to you. And the rich people are saying, no, you don't, we're leaving. And so what you're going to have left is just the socialists. And they're going to, and as Margaret Thatcher said, at some point you run out of other people's money. Again, these young people, again, quoting the Wall Street Journal are that.

Actually, not the young people. The people who are leaving are the taxpayers who pay the bills for the welfare state and for public unions. Good luck funding universal child care and socialist housing with the taxes from grad students and community organizers. And the reason I wanted to share that with you is not so much about New York, but rather because I feel like that kind of thing is going on in Denver. Palantir left Denver. And in general, you see businesses not coming back to Denver, huge vacancies. In the office buildings, for example, and I think we're seeing this in Denver, where the, we're successful people and married couples with decent incomes are leaving. Young people are moving in, voting for socialists who promised to steal the stuff from the better off, the more productive, the people with higher incomes. But those people are saying, no, I'm not going to sit here so that you can just be a parasite off of me. I'm leaving. And we will see what's left. Stairwalt is hot stuff, although he might be in his own mind, but because yesterday at, uh, toward the end of his show, the Hill Sunday on News Nation, he talked about, he talked about disco and people blowing up disco records. So I thought I would play some Donna Summer for him. Chris Steyerwalt is. I believe the best political analyst in the country is political editor of News Nation. As I said, he hosts the Hill Sunday on News Nation on Sunday mornings. He has very strange taste in food, including believing that Pink Roqueford is a good idea. And I just learned that he has a poster of the Muppet animal on his wall, which makes me like him even more. Good morning, Chris. Hey guys, how we doing? Happy Monday. Yeah, happy Monday to you. Maybe a slightly or more than slightly not so happy topic, but I wanted to have you here to talk a little bit about Lindsey Graham because of you, because with your long career in political journalism and time in D.C. You knew him pretty well. You talked to him many times. And I wanted to get just a couple of thoughts from you about what you thought of him as a man. And then also just maybe a little political analysis as to what you think that his loss means for the Senate. Well, I mean, everybody dies. And I think Lindsey Graham. If you do it as a unique American kind of story, you have a person born into not just poverty, but chaotic ignoble poverty. in the town of Center in South Carolina. He's a hillbilly. He's from up in the mountainous region of South Carolina. And his family was a dissolute, as he would tell anybody who would listen. He was raised over a liquor store or a billiard parlor.

And he made a decision as a young man that he was going to better himself. And he was a person, obviously, of extraordinary ambition. He got to the house by 1994. Going from Center, South Carolina to the United States House of Representatives as a young man is pretty impressive. So there was a little of, I was talking with a person familiar with him. And they said there was a little bit of the House of Cards character, Kevin Spacey's character and House of Cards in Lindsey Graham, right? I don't think he ever killed any Washington Post reporters. But a relentlessly ambitious man of humble beginnings in South Carolina who chose politics as his vocation and committed himself fully to it. And Lindsey Graham was. I will shut up just by saying you can like or dislike what Lindsey Graham accomplished, but you will have to acknowledge the accomplishment of it. And I don't just mean here in the personal accomplishment on his way to being elected to a fifth term in the United States Senate and very influential in the United States Senate. But what he did was choose a limited portfolio of issues and focus on them relentlessly. And I don't think that the United States, well, you take the good, you take the bad. I don't think the United States would be at war with Iran or pseudo-war adjacent with Iran right now, necessarily without Lindsey Graham. And I don't think that the United States would be funding and supporting Ukraine right now if it wasn't for Lindsey Graham. So maybe picking up on that last comment, Chris, obviously Lindsey Graham still had a ton of priorities on the table before we saw his sudden passing. So what do the politics of the Senate look like right now with those priorities of Ukraine and Iran of just what happens next? Well, Tom Cotton is a person who shares. many, if not all of Lindsey Graham's views on foreign policy. But he engages with politics like a person who's been asked to eat a drywall sandwich. He is not a happy warrior. Tom Cotton is the obvious heir to Lindsey Graham in that way. You know, Lindsey Graham dealt with Donald Trump, and he dealt with people in the Senate with whom he disagreed on other issues in the same way that he and John McCain would go and deal with quasi-dictators in the third world and other places.

What do I need to tell you? What do I need to say to you? I'll kiss your patootie. I'll say whatever you need me to say, as long as we get where I want to go. And so he was sort of indefatigable. You could dunk him, you could wreck him, you could make fun of him, you could abuse him, and he would come back for more because he was animated by those principles. I don't know that Tom Cotton is willing to go through. what Lindsey Graham was willing to put himself. And it's sort of a larger question about the Senate. We've made the Senate such an awful thing. It's so terrible to be in the United States. It's so terrible to run for the United States Senate. And then you get there and you don't get to do anything except for pull the lever for a bunch of party line votes. The committees don't work. We've had so much brain drain out of the United States Senate. And you need a real retail politician. One thing everybody would tell you about Lindsey Graham. His constituent services were astonishing. Right? If a sparrow could not fall in the state of South Carolina without Lindsey Graham, knowing about it, his team being on it, how can we help? How do we get you back from where you lost your passport? How do we help you get your child into the Coast Guard Academy? What do we do about the post office that got flooded or overtaken by wild boars? Lindsey Graham was, so he was, having a love of politics is necessary. to excel, but if the politics become so awful that only awful people will do it, then who will govern us but awful people? Yeah, you wrote a whole book on Populus. I had you on the show for the book back in the day. Every Man of King. Was that the title of the book? That is a book that I wrote. That is true. So we just have a little over a little over a minute here. And let me run something by you. So, you know, like anybody who is deeply involved with thinking about politics, there was stuff I agreed with Lindsey Graham on and stuff I disagreed with Lindsey Graham on. But one of the things that I could say about Lindsey Graham is, At least, as you said, on the issues that he cared about, I knew what his position was. I could predict what he would say. I knew what he thought. I knew what was important to him. And what I said to listeners a couple hours ago, Chris, is if either of our Colorado senators vanished. And I'm not saying died. I'm not right. But they just, they left. They retired. Whatever. Right. I don't think that the average Coloradoan could look at either of our Colorado senators. If they could even name them.

and say, yes, this person believed in this. This person stood for that. And I wonder if more of the Senate is now like our Colorado worthless people, I think it is, versus like Lindsey Graham, whether you agree with him or not, at least you know what he's about. Yeah, I mean, look, there's a place for workhorse. There's a lot of members of the United States Senate that we never hear about. who are doing what they consider to be important and valuable work. And I don't think you have to be out, though they're all welcome to come on the Hill Sunday. You don't have to be out on television every week and in the fight of public opinion in that way. The work can be done in quiet. I would contrast Lindsey Graham with somebody like Tom Cole, the chairman of the House Appropriations Committee. Tom Cole gets a ton of stuff done and gets his priorities through, and not one in ten Americans could tell you who Tom Cole was. So you don't have to do it, Lindsey Graham style. But I do think that you're the point about if you don't stand for something, you'll fall for anything, is true, right? As my old daddy used to say, the time to decide whether or the night you want to kill a deer is before you go hunting. Know before you go what's important to you and limit the number of things, but know what they are and stick to it. Chris Steyerwalt is the political editor at News Nation, my favorite cable TV network by far. I never miss Chris's show. It's called The Hill Sunday on Sunday mornings. And now I know he has a poster of animal on the wall in his house. So another feather in his cap. Thank you so much, Chris, for making time for us. I dig it, brother. I dig it, brother. Have a great day. All right, you too. All right, he really is the best political analyst in America. Grateful for his time. All right, there are things going on in the rest of the world, including Iran, where Gina has an update right now. All right. Chris Steyerwalt is super interesting. What did you think of that, Gina? His answers were just kind of along a whole different way of thinking. than, you know, when you talk to a senator who knew him, it was very, I found his, found his answers really, really interesting. I like, there was a couple questions he answered with me, not even asking the question, because I wondered who is the next similar Lindsey Graham. And I wanted, that was one that I was hoping to ask him. And then he pretty much just went off and explaining of like what the succession plan looks like of who can really take the reins and going next and how. You know, cotton is still very different, but might have a little bit of a gram flare to him as well. He might. The thing is, So I've had Tom Cotton on the show a couple times. And in the aftermath of Steyerwald saying that, maybe I'll try to get him back. But like, as Chris Steyerwald was saying, you know, Lindsey Graham is always smiling and joking and just Tom Cotton's not like that. You know, he's a very serious guy, former Army infantry, Harvard Law maybe as well, and just a very serious dude. And I suspect.

for either of them. Can you? Well, I think that's what a lot of people had with the issue of Senator Bennett when they were trying to make their gubernatorial pick. Right. Is a lot of people, whether they stood for wiser or not, they kept looking at Bennett and saying, well, I don't actually know what he's done. Yeah. So I'm not sure what will he do as governor. But then also you have that double-edged sort of, okay, if you don't know what he did, then why do you want him still in Senate? But it's like that was the kind of wiser's push of keeping him in the Senate and becoming governor, vice versa. But yeah, I mean, it's challenging. Haken Looper has been around for so, so long. And people continue to reelect him and put him back in office. But could you say? I don't know. I don't know. I really don't. And, you know, Hickey Looper's been around forever in lots of different offices. Bennett has been in the Senate for 16 years. I can't believe it's been 16 years already. And I can't tell you anything he deeply, truly believes. And I do think that hurt him in the primary, as Gina said. I do want to say, I appreciated Chris Steyerwalt's sort of. gentle pushback on me where where he said, look, not everybody needs to be out in front of the TV cameras. And Lindsey Graham loved to be in front of the TV cameras, right? He was he was supposed to be on Meet the Press yesterday and that was going to be his 60 something appearance on Meet the Press. He loved the cameras. Not everybody's like that. And you don't have to be like that to do a good job. So maybe I'm a little unfair to our senators, but still I can't tell you what they believe. or what they've accomplished. So, you know, there we are. Gina found the dude who made the Cheesman Park video game. So we're going to lighten it up a little bit after some news weather and traffic and talk with that dude. I'm very excited for this conversation because it was something I stumbled upon on Reddit and then found myself playing over the weekend. Ross did as well. Denver Software Engineer created a free video game that's centered around all the lure and the fun of Cheeseman Park. Good poll there, Shannon. I liked that. Cheesman Park first a graveyard. So in this game, you're killing zombies, you're killing ghosts, other random little creatures here and there. vampires that come to life after the sunsets and just all the festivities that you see in Cheesman Park during the day as well. So joining us to talk more about it as the creator of Cheesmanparkthegame.com. It's Casey, thank you so much your time this morning. I appreciate it. Good morning. Thank you for having me. Let's start with the why. Why in the world did you decide? Okay, you know what, Cheesman Park? Yeah, this could be a fun video game. I have an idea here. Yeah, you know, when I first moved to Denver, Cheesman Park was one of the first places I went to, and I instantly fell in love with it. And then once I heard the history of it, learned about, you know, how was Denver's first cemetery and kind of that grim pass with E.P. McGovern, you know, the gears started turning. And instantly, I was like, this could make a really cool experience online, maybe a game or something to do with it. And it kind of just snowballed from there. Explain to people who E.P. McGovern is if they do not know, because he appears in your video game as well.

Absolutely. So for those who don't know the history of Cheesman Park, it used to be a cemetery. And then when they decided to turn it into it in actual park in Denver, they hired an undertaker named E.P. McGovern. And in the year 1893, he was tasked with removing the extra bodies and relocating them. And he was paid by the coffin that he was able to fill and then move. And he took a little few shortcuts and started using children's coffins, you know, to make more money. And I don't want to get too gruesome here, but he didn't do the best job. And he left the job incomplete, as they say. So there's still some bodies there in Cheesman. And my game kind of explores, you know, what happens late at night with the unfinished work of E.P. McGovern. I love the old school styling of the game, right? I'm old enough to have played Atari and stuff like that back in the day with these, you know, highly pixelated games going all the way back to Pong. I even remember that one. And so what made, how did you choose the style? Yeah, it's a great question. You know, initially I was going to do it a little bit more advanced on the graphics and create actual artwork that, you know, that the computer would have to load. But the way that this, the game currently is, it's a very, very light game. So it was an aesthetic decision. So I wanted to have that old 80s feel, kind of arcade-like feel, because the game itself is kind of like an arcade game. But from like a development point, because I'm also a software engineer, I was, I was. I like the idea of having procedurally generated graphics just because that makes it easy for the game to be played on a mobile phone. It has a light footprint, pretty easy for any device to be able to run it. So it was a decision of, you know, I love the 80s arcade field, but also I wanted it to run very, very smoothly on a mobile device. Okay, so from that development standpoint that you mentioned, was the game pretty easy to put together? Is it something that... took you a while or what was the process as a software engineer with maybe not getting too much into the very nitty details like none of us will understand. How is it put together? I'm not a game developer by trade. I'm just a back-end software engineer. So I know some of the skills, but I don't know all of the skills for game development. So actually, I was able to make this game in about a week with the help of something called Claude. So this is a, you know, an LLM, you know, an AI model. So where I'm able to, you know, do what I'm good at with software engineering, you know, cloud helps me do that even better. And then the areas where, you know, I kind of have some gaps in my knowledge on, you know, how do we make this work for a game on a browser? Cloud's able to kind of fill in those gaps. So it's been a really great pair programming process. And again, the game's pretty simple. So I was able to develop it and iterate it over about a week. That's amazing. That's absolutely amazing. Casey Canter's game is called Cheesman Park the game. That's the website. Cheesmanpark the game.com. Now, obviously, you're not going to want to go into much detail if the answer is yes. But are there Easter eggs in the game? Are there things you just have to play to find that don't show up in a menu like you can buy this in the store and whatever?

Yeah, I would say there are a few Easter eggs. You know, one Easter egg, I don't know if it would qualify as an Easter egg, but we have a, I have a good friend who was a dog named Sprout, and we always take Sprout over to the park. And there's just this really wonderful little dog meetup of all the owners and everything. And it just seems so fun. And I don't even have a dog, so I get to go in there and there. And I feel like. You know, like just lucky to be there and hang out with all the dogs. So I added Sprout the dog. She's a corgi in the game. And every day you can walk over to the dog meetup and give Sprouts and pets for extra points. So that's a little fun part of the game. Oh, nice. Okay, I am curious because you're the creator of it. You can also select your player. And there's like the runner, your typical Cheesman Park goers, the runner, the hippie, the yogi, things like that. The tech bro. Yeah. Is there one that you think is the best out of all the rest? Well, I can tell you what people pick. Most people are playing the tech bro, which I was not expecting. When I play, I like playing the volleyball bro. I think the volleyball bro has a lot of fun abilities. In terms of what's the best, that's kind of hard to answer. These games, people are so good at playing different characters. Just as an example, I made the game, and I posted the first high score, and I know all the secrets of the game. And then within two hours, people have already doubled my high score. And now the leaderboard, people are doing two, three hour long runs. I've 10xed my score. So I don't even know if I'm the best person to ask, like, which character is the best character? You'd have to ask the players. Yeah, the leaderboard definitely 10xed my score too. I thought I did well. And then I looked at the leaderboard and I was like, wow, people are putting work for this game for sure. Dude, I get stuck in the pond. So I don't know what to do. It's funny you say that. Have you got stuck in the pond, or is there a way out of the pond? So I got your email. You had the screenshot. It was great. By the way, if anyone has any bugs or unexpected behavior with the game, you can email me. I have the email at the end of the game. It's like pietchee'sman park at the game.com. But, Ross, you sent that screenshot. I've already started patching the issue. You found a bug. Congratulations. After this interview, I'll patch it so, so no other players get trapped in the pond. Casey Cantor, do you have any expectations of what you're going to do with the game going forward? Is it just going to be a free game that people can enjoy or any future aspirations with it? It'll absolutely always be free. I certainly would never monetize this game. It's my homage to Cheesman Park. I think if in terms of the future, I'd love to make new changes like seasonally. Maybe I'll make it look like fall in the fall. If there are any like big events or like new features added to Cheesman Park that everyone in the community knows about, I would love to add those, keep it current. But really just want to leave it up for the public. Perfect. Cheesmanparkthegame.com. Don't forget Cheeseman is not like. cheese, C-H-E-E-S, no extra E, Cheesmanparkthegame.com. I've enjoyed it. I appreciate you joining us this morning and talking more about it. It's been super fun. Thank you. Awesome. Well, thank you so much for having me. It's been a blast.

That's great. I can't believe I found a bug. He's fixing your bugs. I got stuck in the pond. What am I doing? The zombies are attacking me from all sides and I'm stuck in the pond. Could you still shoot them when you're in the pond? Yeah. But you couldn't move around. So I had picked up the... The dog leashed it that you can use as a whip to kind of whip the zombies and the other little creatures that look like the monsters in Pac-Man, right? And so I was whipping them. And it was fine, but I couldn't move. So now he's fixing it. Oh, I love that. I picked the hippie as my character. I picked the tech bro, actually. Believe it or not. All right. That was great getting him, Gina. That was a really, a really great one. Okay, we're going to do a little news weather and traffic here. And then I'm going to tell you about an announcement that President Trump just made about the Strait of Hormuz that I will say at the least is very interesting. All right. Gina, what did you say President Trump just posted on social media about who should at least temporarily fill Lindsey Graham's Senate seat? He said just five minutes ago on Truth Social, I recommend to the governor that Lindsey Graham's wonderful sister, Darlene, to serve as interim senator from the great state of South Carolina. This would be a fabulous tribute to Lindsay who loved her dearly. I believe she is a nurse or in some kind of business involved in, like, helping people. I don't think she has any political experience or any interest in it. And I actually think in a way, I think that's kind of clever of Donald Trump to say that because it's not going to happen. And yet, at least for a while, it sort of briefly at least gets him off the hook of any pressure to endorse somebody else. Ralph Norman, who is a pretty wacky 71-year-old congressman from South Carolina, didn't even wait until the body was cold to contact President Trump and ask Trump to endorse him. So there's that. Oh, I didn't mention this before. Let me mention it real quick. And then I'll tell you the Strait of Hormuz news that's just breaking now. So here's what happens. The governor of South Carolina appoints somebody to serve out the remainder of this term for Lindsey Graham. This term ends in January. And functionally, it's going to end in December. They go on their way. So functionally, it's going to end in December. So the governor, Henry McMaster, is going to appoint somebody to serve. that time. Now, in the meantime, there are going to be folks who, you know, throw their names in the ring and get into a primary election.

On August 11th, I believe it is. Anyway, there's going to be a new primary election. And then the winner of that primary will then be in the general election in November against the Democrat who was already selected during the primary election that took place already in that state. Lindsey Graham had already won the primary election in South Carolina, but obviously he's not going to be the candidate. Now, so there will be another. primary election. And that might or might not involve the person who Governor Henry McMaster appoints to hold the seat in the meantime. It could be someone who's just a placeholder who has no intention of running. to have the seat in the longer term, and that's one strategy, or it could be that Henry McMaster appoints someone who he knows wants to run to hold the seat for the long run and wants to give that person a boost. There's a lot of different ways it could play out, but that's the concept there. All right, so. President Trump also posted on social media just a little bit ago that the United States is going to charge a fee for transit through the Strait of Hormuz of 20% of the value of all the cargo being shipped. He says we will become guardians of the straight. He said this on Fox and Friends this morning. He said, we're going to hit Iran very hard and keep the straight and probably run it. He said all other countries will have fair and open use of the strait, but as a matter of fairness, the U.S. will be reimbursed at the rate of 20% on all cargo shipped for any and all costs necessary to do the job of providing safety and security to this very volatile section of the world. So my prediction is this won't happen. It's going to cause all kinds of outcry. It might. have the impact of nudging some of our allies or theoretical allies to get off their butts and do a little more work and, you know, help us to keep the straight of Hormuz open. What President Trump is proposing is wildly illegal, just as he said it would be for Iran. to impose a fee to transit the Strait of Hormuz. I can't say I fully understand why he's doing this, but I suspect some of it is to get European allies and Gulf Arab allies. I put the word ally in some kind of air quotes there to do more to help us to keep the straight open. In any case, a very interesting move by President Trump. Have a great rest of your Monday. Michael Brown up next.